It seems, no matter how much I plan ahead (sketching, using CAD or Sketchup) my maps always wind up changing drastically once I get into Forge. My biggest problems are object quantity restrictions and costs... I have a hard time predicting them while planning and have to either change the map drastically or compromise something somewhere... As a result, I often plan to a point and then jump into Forge and get some of the idea built, run around to make sure it's working as planned, then pull back and plan more... back and forth... And, I won't tell you how many maps I've had to scrap, or put to one side, because it just wasn't working as I had originally anticipated...
I sort of start with an idea of layout flow, then decide where to put the map, then decide what type of bases ect the i build it. Eg. my new map, vahallaish feel but smaller more fats paced, location : quarry aesthetics forerunner but colourful and then I just sat down and built it, now I will tweak it and test it to death until i release then.. it will get buried under hordes of terrible maps like most good maps out there.
It works both ways, I plan some of it, but other times I discover exploits completely by experimenting, but it's always good to have a plan, even if it's about what you're experimenting on, because it makes everything more efficient.
For my race maps: 1. I choose a location. 2. I decide where i want the track to start. 3. Then i decide with every couple of meters where i want the track to continue. 4. I pick location where it would look *good* for a racer to go, for example: ''do a jump''/ ''race to''/''go up''/''go down'', and other stuff like that.
I start with a major idea but then most of the map becomes improv and trial and error. Seems to work for me. As for forging completely blind I think its stupid. If you don't have a focal point or something that stands out within your map it wont be as successful.
i usually get most ideas while doing other things than forging then once i try to recreat the awesome ideas in my head i tweak and refine what works and what doesn't work as i thought it would in my head then once satisfied move onto the next idea i had. more than half the time i get inspiration in the middle of forging my first idea and get distracted. that's why it is tough for me to finish a map. :/
i get ideas but not while im playing so i draw them and thus a plan is born ill probably end up with 50 map ideas by June because i put my xbox up for school so I cant build them, so i guess that makes me a planner lol sorry, didn't realize this had died amd just randomly been resurrected
I do both Normally when I start I have a basic idea (if its symmetrical or something) but from there on I just go with the flow. When I made a new piece of the map I walk back and forth and everything, just to get the feeling and get an idea what to do next.
Plan, plan, plan, plan, plan. Thumbnail sketches, rough combat maps, flow diagrams, multiple floor plans, driving routes, concept sketches... it's easy to randomly throw down a couple of blocks and ramps and then see how it plays. It takes a lot of effort to make a map that plays the way you want it to play from the get-go. For me, it's an iterative process. The first few things I listed always come first, but after that I jump into forge and do a rough mass-out that lets me then refine my design. More planning, and then I'll start "rough draft" construction, all the while making various tweaks and changes to the design. Once I'm satisfied with the layout, I go back around for the "cleanup" pass, snapping objects, adding railings, placing movable objects, adjusting ramps, and so on. Weapons and spawns come next, followed by a final flow analysis and further tweaks, and then a map is ready to test.
I've actually found that as much as I do plan I really am not familiar enough with every aspect of Reach to plan effectively. Some map ideas come randomly to me while in Forge then I go about designing the rest of it on paper, then sometimes I pre-plan it pretty thoroughly. My invasion map came from the former situation. I came up with a scenario in forge then planned the rest of it on paper. The dilemma came when the paper plan didn't work for **** so I scrapped damn near half the map and redesigned it on the fly. Now it plays exceptionally well and it was totally unintended. Planning is always a good step but a plan isn't all you need to do. Test your plan and if it doesn't don't be afraid to work with other options.
I generally start off with scratching various ideas down on a note pad, utilizing the most basic geometric shapes possible. I assign arrows and such to work out how I expect the map to flow and where I want high traffic areas to be. Slowly over time I start to elaborate more on the geometry of the sketch and start considering how I want to compose it in FW. Then comes the sit down forge fest... Most often I abandon parts of the sketch and go back to stage one, working on how to create a particular part of the map as the idea was off. If I can't break through with a solid idea I invite friends in to help. All in all, it generally takes me 2 to 3 months to get a map complete from pencil sketch up to play tested and balanced released version. And I spend a good number of hours working on these projects a day when I'm motivated. ^ Because of such long development cycles, I find it hard to respect maps that are cranked out by some individuals at a weekly basis.
Exactly. You need a good balance between planning and free-flowing. If you plan too much the map generally becomes quite boring as you've tried to plan everything. You create a specific spot for sniping, a spot where the shotgun is extra effective etc. Players don't like being told, "You! Snipe here!" They like finding the "perfect sniping" spot themselves. So if you really want to plan out your map completely try and make these things inconspicuous. But regardless of it being planned or free-formed the map needs to be fun to move about on. Even if you're just by yourself. If it's not fun to move about then it's not gonna be a very popular map. What I do is create a mental image of the basic layout and how I want the map to flow and then go from there, free-forming it, but still loosly basing it on that original image.
Yeah, I've found that planning ruins my maps and not planning is just as bad. So I think of an idea, let it marinate in my head for a few weeks and formulate a basic flow that seems like it could really work, then just start building to that ideal.
I dont plan, ever. My style of forging is what I call 'Snowball Forging'. By that I mean a small ball of snow being pushed over the crest of a hill. It starts of small and slow but as it starts to roll it gets faster and bigger and eventually it takes its own course. I have tried to plan maps usinh sketchup and drawings but I just prefer to get into forge straight away and see what happens.
Generally, I have a random idea pop into my head that I just think, "Whoah, yep; that is my next map. I have a map preview up for my map Riparian right now, which started this way while I was running in poaring rain and thought of making a river map. When I got back I found a spot that suited me in forge world, put on the bounderies, and started planning out the rest on paper. Overall, most of my maps are all on paper or in Solidworks (like Sketchup's big brother) before anything is placed in forge world, especially smaller, indoor maps.
I did plan my maps, but when I did I became too ambitious, especially on indoor area's. Now I'm forging smaller maps, generally symmetrical with simple red base vs blue base layout. It's a lot more relaxing without a plan.
a little of both. gotta have a basic idea or goal, even if its just 'i want a lot of explosions', or some general idea of how it will play out. theme/atmosphere of the map can come in the end though, as long as you got the basics right. as far as layout planning goes, i plan in forge. its not like theres some detriment to deleting things, and it lets you know what the limitations will be. only thing is you have to get over is deleting those pieces you so gingerly placed haha.
I always plan a general idea. Say I wanted to create a symmetrical arena style map I would start with a basic design idea in my head, like say big center and outlying walks and ramps. Then I start on the center piece, building it to roughly what I want it to be. Then I start building out and/or up. Usually things change a lot over the course of the build. I may have one thing in mind and then by the time I get down to it I realize that perhaps a different direction would work better. I liken my maps to a Rubics cube, when I start everything is random and out of order, but by the time I'm done everything is the same color. Ultimately you should forge the way that makes you comfortable. Don't listen to some of the idiots in this thread. If you forge fast and get maps out in the blink of an eye, or you take months to finish one, the only thing that matters is that you have fun and people have fun on your maps. You don't need to take it so seriously, just do what you like and hope others like it as well. And be versatile. If all you pump out is competitive maps that all look alike people will get sick of that. Try and make an awesome objective map, and maybe a mini game. Or try your hand at infection, or a casual type time killer. Variety is the spice of Forge. And yes I am that corny.
I pretty much have to have a general idea laid out first. If I don't plan then I won't have anywhere else to go. CAN WE LET THIS THREAD DIE NOW?