Cargo Port and Omar just go together like... Cargo Port and Omar. Actually though, most maps don't have the high, inescapable ceiling needed. It would be annoying to go up so high to find yourself over the map boundaries, and hammer spamming can shoot you WAY up there. Still, I would like to see someone design another map that could support Omar. Hm... Just maybe...
Omor works so well on Cargo Port because Cargo Port has more verticle space than any other map I've played. Also, Omar is Cargo Port's thing, it doesn't need to be played anywhere else. I guess I should probably take those Omar pics like I said I would however long ago...
I've never heard of anyone re-creating a campaign scene for a map idea. It's awesome. Didn't realize it until I watched the forging spotlight video. You must have looked very hard at Exodus because it is spot on! Cool idea.
When you post a map, you should be prepared to receive feedback. Here is mine: 1. Framerate: The way you forged this map seems careless. There is an abundance of framerate causing objects scattered throughout the map that are entirely unnecessary (walkway covers, railings, glass sails, bridge larges, landing pads, 5x1) and could be replaced with more framerate friendly objects. 2. Balance: One side is clearly more powerful and possess all the advantages of the map. Usually when people design a map that has a dominant position, they try to balance it out by: blocking los, having multiple routes to the area, having power weapons on the opposite side of the map, etc. But the power position has ultimately three routes up to it, and has los over the majority of the map. You have enough los blocked to give the other team a safe spawn, but once they try to move, they are exposed. 3. Flow: A good map is one that keeps players moving, which also ties into balance. This map is a race to the top of the hill, and once you get there, there is no need to ever move. You just watch the other team make their pathetic attempt to take over your stronghold, and meet their imminent doom. I understand this is a remake of a location from the Reach campaign, but this map shows that you should not take geometry from a single player campaign, and try to play it as a multiplayer map, unless you make some altercations to the design.
I've played the first version of this map several times in the past and was never really a big fan of it like so many others are, but I could see the appeal it had for players who enjoy themselves a more casual game. I don't know if you've made any major changes to fix personal grievances I have with the map's layout, but from the pictures it looks relatively unchanged overall since it's supposed to be a remake. It's sort of unfortunate to see this map winning the "Best Competitive," category, since it's only enforcing that, rather than play all the maps nominated, people were just voting for their friends' map. Being nominated for "Best Objective" or "Best Slayer" would have been more appropriate. Heck, maybe even "Best Casual" considering the most popular game-type on it appears to be one where you fly around with jet-packs and hammers. From the bottom left corner of the map in the 1st picture, there are only 2 ways out (it looks like something may have changed here, but the pictures don't really show it if it has), and one of them is an exposed platform you have to jump to. When a team has control of the top, I found myself constantly spawning down there and barely making it up the lift, which only leads you to another exposed location, without getting shot up by DMRs. You could take the other hallway route, but that's only an uphill battle against grenades (and a hammer if that still remains in this 3k version). Aside from that specific issue, I pretty much agree with all the things Xzamples has told you. My eye for framerate isn't quite as sensitive, but I don't remember too many problems with it myself. Can't say for sure since it's been a while. With all of that said, I did have fun those times I did play it. I never felt the map was competitive though, since it was generally oriented towards accurately portraying a section of the campaign rather than being built for actual, competitive game-play. It's sort of disappointing to see it take the cake away from the other nominees, all of whom had much more competitive maps (that were built from the ground-up as such) up for nomination.
I like the map because it is unorthodox and isn't well balanced. I like it because it has an aesthetic theme and still plays well enough to be enjoyable. The flow is one directional, but thats how many popular maps play as well... Looking at you Contstruct/Narrows/IvoryTower/Standoff/Etc. Its always been a joy to play. As for framerate... Its no where near as bad xzamtroll makes it out to be. He's just hating 'cuz he can't forge. There is some frame drops tho.
Listen, just because you have a different opinion of the map as me, does not mean that I am trolling. This map won best competitive, even though there are some very basic design flaws, which is ridiculous. Construct is a circle with many different routes up from the bottom, which gives the losing team a good chance to overtake the team controlling the upper portion. Top mid was the most powerful position on Narrows, but the combination of weapon setup plus the bottom middle made top mid a difficult position to control. Ivory Tower/Reflection you may have a point, but Bungie realized that the map would play in that manner, and made sure the losing team could have every opportunity possible to overtake the power position (rockets, shotgun, sword, access from multiple routes in completely different directions, etc.). Standoff is one flat battlefield with the bases as the highest point of the map. That's why it's called standoff. None of those maps suffer from flow as severe as Cargo Port. I'm hating because I can't forge? I don't know where you got that from. If you like maps that have these generally bad characteristics, that's fine. But when you defend a map, you should make it less obvious that you are doing so because of your friendship with Psychoduck.
Worst defense of a map ever. I like Cargo Port and I do believe it belonged in a BoF spot, but not in the competitive spot. Since I've never liked for single entrants to take multiple slots I would have liked to have seen Cargo Port win Best Casual because in my eyes Cargo Port is something that would be played casually. Spoiler Covering my own ass I want to say that I think Armor Walkers is singlehandedly the best mini-game I've ever played, but it ironically won two categories where Best Mini-game wasn't one of them. I really think this was a case of bad categorization with little restriction on which maps belonged in which category. But, I digress... Cargo Port does have its fair share of problems and Psycho is well aware of my gripes, but that doesn't change the fact that the map is fun to play (on Invasion at least) and that is generally what matters... in a Casual map. However, when one thinks of competitive maps one thinks of layout balance, weapon balance, multiple routes into areas, counters to powerful areas, etc. with less focus on aesthetics, objectives and gimmicks. I'll defend this map tooth and nail in the proper section. I've seen it progress from very early stages in development and go from a purely unenjoyable rip from a section of Reach's campaign to a fun reenactment of the campaign that feels much more like its own experience. I must say though, that when Cargo Port is compared to something like Kuroda or Spade's competitive maps, something seems to have gone wrong in the process. So is the beauty of Democracy though in that the most well known and well promoted often takes the spoils, and another thing that Psycho did beautifully with Cargo Port is make it very well known across the whole community.
Absolutely, I'm always very open to consrtuctive feedback. Most of what you've said is correct. However, there are a few areas where you've missed something. Firstly, I'm very aware of which objects cause framerate, and I am therefore incredibly surprised that there have never been any framerate issues with this map. Of course if there had been, the 5x1s, glass sails, and railings would have been the first things to go. As far as balance and flow, yes the restricted paths are a problem, and the map does suffer from rather exacerbated issues that we saw on Consrtuct in Halo 3. To counter this somewhat, the power weapons all spawn towards the bottom of the map, and the sniper in particular is very effective for a team trying to regain top control. It's certainly not impossible to regain control of the top, but it is certainly more difficult than it should be. Lastly to you, I have never really spoken with Proximo before, so his defense of the map has nothing to do with any friendship we share. While I appreciate his defense, I think his shot at you was unfounded and uncalled for. Thank you for providing me with feedback, xzamples. Yes, Cargo Port clearly won the wrong BoF slot. I specifically voted against it in the best competitive poll for that reason. From a competitive standpoint, Cargo Port is very much inferior to most of the other maps in the poll. Now for the good news. About a month ago, I began a map project. The basis for which, was to create a 4v4 invasion experience that actually worked well with invasion principles, while differentiating itself from a 6v6 invasion gametype. To support this gametype, I built, from the ground up, a brand new version of Cargo Port. Unfortunately,this invasion gametype didn't work for reasons too lengthy to get into here. However, the new version of Cargo Port strays away from the campaign layout purposefully. There are now four main ways to the top of the map, with another secondary route as well. The map also has differing sightlines from the original, which I have engineered specifically to take the advantage away from the top. This combined with the map's weapon set has made this new version (Dubbed exchange) much more fun, and much more competitively solid. Thanks for the feedback guys, I'll make sure to get some screenshots of Exchange up soon, so everyone can see what I'm talking about. Believe me, I am very familiar with Cargo Port's issues, and I am very confident that I have solved them all with Exchange.
So, I've gotten games on this before, and I thought I'd write a bit about it. Played this in SWAT, Slayer and I think we might have done KOTH. Love love love the flow of the map. The few campers that we had, didn't have a place to go. The people that moved owned the map. Overall, a really well designed map, with little or no framerate loss. Good Job!
This looks really cool, it's like a mix between countdown and headlong, I like how the buildings feel like they have a purpose as well. Really great aesthetics as well.