1. Spawning was fine, no complaints. 2. I like the turret. Found it useful but not overpowering. 3. No complaints, except I don't really like the rockets in the high middle of the ship; it seems like only jetpackers ever get them. Which benefits me, but not the non-jetpackers. 4. I like the mantis personally. 5. I'm not sure if you should focus on other gametypes too much. The design is so specialized that it seems like it will do one thing very well and a lot of other things not nearly as well. However, I might like to try team snipers... - Banshee arrival delay by 5 seconds would be helpful. It was hard to get a mantis out without immediately being hit by a banshee bomb. So either delay the banshees, or spawn some guys with a more convenient approach to the mantis bay. - That will help too. - Possibly. In the games last night it seemed like the banshees won the war; but in previous tests it seemed like the banshees were generally shot down before the flag was ever touched. Might just need further testing - any given one or two tests can be misleading. -- Regarding the Vandelay tests, I liked the KOTH game (a lot actually) but was let down by oddball. I'm going to be blocking off the teleporters for that gametype, and I need to figure out why throwing the ball off the map was resulting in it just sitting there for a long time; I know every external area is covered by a soft or hard kill zone, or falls outside of the soft safe zone, so I'm not really sure why that kept happening. Yet another thing that was probably changed from Reach that didn't need changing..! It also makes me concerned that my other maps may have the same issue, since I usually do my safe and kill zones about the same way from map to map. Next time we'll probably run CTF again - I didn't do it last night for a change of pace, but I really do need to run it with the new build to make sure I didn't mess it up - and then maybe get back to testing Octave as well. I'm thinking that may be an entry for the 2v2 Dust-Up tourney, I just like it with fewer people on it. It has that Guardian thing where it's fine for 4v4, but has maybe better pacing for 2v2.
Here's feedback for payload 1.) Spawning – Had no issue, I like the suggestion to spawn a few guys down with the Mech 2.) Dominion Turrets – I liked having these they worked well. 3.) Weapons – The only thing I could think to add is maybe a Plazma Pistol to shoot down banshees on the table at the initial spawn. 4.) RockHog vs Mantis – I think Mantis is better, if they could spawn next to each other rather than one behind the other it might help. 5.) Gametypes – KOTH might be fun to play and use more areas of the ship, but 1Flag is money. Ill leave more on each map later
Payload: I was a bit late to the games last night, so I would first like to apologize for that. I was getting things done elsewhere and lost track of time, and realized I hadn't even eaten yet- something I needed to do before TCOJ. I went into this map not knowing a single thing, when I asked who had made it someone responded 'Hulk', and I cannot describe my excitement. Hulk, your maps have this odd sense of controlled chaos that makes for an interesting line between casual and competitive gameplay. I'm not sure how to describe it too well, but every map of yours has been this way and it's been amazing. Now, as for my comments on that map, I'll adhere mostly to what you asked for. In terms of spawning, I never noticed any bad areas that i ended up in. Regarding the dominion turrets, i found them highly discouraging when they were set up and I was attacking. However, the ones on the side of the larger structure (highest elevated ones) were not often (if at all) used. They just seem to be in a spot that nobody looks when defending. I would suggest moving them to a more obvious location. Looking at the weaponry on the map, I think one more anti-banshee weapon is possibly needed, but nothing too strong (also, I noticed that rockets were difficult to gt to without jetpack. I generally felt incapacitated if not using that ability). maybe just one more railgun, or a plasma pistol if none currently exist on the map. As for the mantis', I think all they need is a second (or third) exit to use so that they aren't funneled down the one exit of doom. I wouldn't bother with any other gametypes unless we get more 1-sided ones. 1 flag is amazing here, the only other option I can think of would be a large hill in one spot that doesn't move that is contested for, but that doesn't work as well in Halo. Sky Garden: Oh, the ever loved infinite jet pack map makes a comeback with another author. Please, take my critisism with a grain of salt, because I really just don't enjoy this sort of game. The map was generally confusing, and at the end of it all, I still had no idea what this layout was (aside from being squareish and having a rock top). I had no idea what use the banshee had, the infantry could already fly (making the bomb mostly useless) and easily skyjack the machine. Although, why bother skyjacking when you can just get an easy kill on such a big target? Spawning worked fine, though the map seemed generally larger than it needed to be for 4v4, so that was expected. Some sections of the map seemed awkward, sich as all of the 1x5 thin walkways, they just didn't mesh well. Overall, I just didn't like this one, but like I said earlier, I'm not a fan of this sort of game setting list. Rampant Revenge: In contrast to Sky Garden, this was a blast. Nothing went poorly, and even in death there was fun to be had. The layout was better than the original warthog bumper car death pit maps, and the rockets added a sense of fear when there were only two of the hogs left. Well done, I didn't find a single thing wrong. Archway: I could see a definite narrows similarity, and the map layout was easy to grasp, but I had some issues with it all still. I really disliked some of the geometry, such as a fe wof the incredibly narrow doorswhere some of the hills were. I went from claustrophobic to an incredibly open area quickly, and it was unsettling. Honestly, I found the map odd, it emphasized the bridge so much, but not much action happened, there was just no reason to go there with so much on the sides and safe passage everywhere else. It flet like Narrows mixed with Zealot, and that it took on the errors of the latter map. If not for the hills, I don't know why I would ever go to the center. Vandelay: An interesting map, but likely the weakest as far as I'm concerned among your ridiculous amount of projects. The teleporter got camped hard (especially in oddball), and the lifts make it difficult to just go to the bottom floor if you hit them (a major issue of mine). The layout is nice and easy to grasp, but the middle (including teleporters) seem very difficult to escape/assault through. I felt like I was constantly able to be brutally murdered if I went to any of these places. All that aside, the map had well chosen weapons, and good spawns. The action was fast and when you died, you got back to it quick and without any spawning issues. I just wish there was more that allowed travel between the top and bottom, and I'm finding the top center (and tele) are just unbalanced. its too easy to take cover there, but if you get someone running after you there you have nowhere to run. Avalon This is an entertaining map, but there are a few issues I found. As Hulk said, the action is all around the upper ring. You really should throw in some line of sight blockers and other appealing areas to make this not suffer the same fate as Zealot did (run around the ring, nothing else). I also noticed that the ghost was gone and I never got an absurd amount of railgun/sticky det shots in one gun, so I'm glad that you made those changes. The map is fun, but with some improvement I'm certain it could be pretty darn fantastic. For now, just focus on alleviating Zealot Syndrome. Gulchmine This was not fun. It was static (stay on your side unless you want to die) and rather boring because of that. The long distance battles would have been fun it they were not the only thing you could do to effectively kill. The map needs a heavy redesign or abandonment. Radiant I love this map. I wish there was more to say, but it's just fun and I cant think of anything I didn't like. Just don't release it yet, I want to keep testing it. Headlong Basically, fix that framerate and you could be golden. I'm not too familiar with the origional map (or the Reach remake), so I cant say what you did accurately or not and I could never know if it was all perfect, but the map was fun. If there was no lag, I think it would have been extremely enjoyable.
Were you trying to drop down the hole from the top floor? That's really not intended to be used that way, though it can be if you're good at trick-jumping. The routes to the bottom are supposed to be the two sides with the ramps, and the drop-shaft in the back (behind where the railgun or sticky det spawn), plus the teleporters. If you try to drop down the big middle hole you'll usually just shoot right back up; that's intentional, and that's why there are railings. In fact I originally had railings on all four sides of the upper level opening, but I removed two of them because it was contributing to the problem of corpses bouncing up and down in the lifts over and over. As for the teleporter, I may just block it off in oddball. I knew that was a danger of having a 2-way tele, and this test confirmed my fears. In other gametypes it should be fine, as there's not much incentive to use that awful tactic. Next time we'll run CTF again, as I think that's really where the map shines. Hmm. Apart from the oddball game, I've generally felt like the teleporters and center room are actually a bit under-used; I ran through them a number of times in KOTH without getting waylaid. Most of the action on the map seems to go from end-to-end because of the elongated layout and open lines of sight; I see a lot more people running the whole length of the map on one side or the other than cutting through the middle. Another thing I could possibly do with the teleporters is put them back the way they were - one-way portals to or from top mid, instead of two-way between the two halves of the bottom level. Any opinions on this? I originally had them as 1-way from the bottom to the top mid on the other side, but I could go in the other direction to provide a quick escape from that top mid room, and still push traffic/provide access to the bottom. And that would eliminate most of the annoying oddball shenanigans - one-way teles are far better for oddball than 2-way.
Yes, and I'd like to be able to do that with ease rather than try the trick jump and potentially fail, only to be lifted up in the air helplessly. They are not used much, but whenever i did fight there, it always seemed one-sided. I just generally don't like the entrances between them, they are narrow and prone to grenade spam, and only give 2 options of entrance/exit. Thus, if you watch the radar, you know which side a bit before they appear, and can just wait or toss a grenade. The middle doesn't get used a while lot, but when it does it doesn't feel very nice. Honestly, i'm not a fan of teleporters, but if you want to keep them, I feel like they should be only on the bottom levels and one way. I'm not sure exactly where they should be, but I wasn't fond of the way they were or how they are now.
Oh, also: doesn't look like I'm going to have time to do a full recap today, due to work stuff (sigh) and going out of town tonight. So I'll just give a few quick hitters: AnotherClaymore: one minor thing to fix - there is a spawn point or two inside the side tunnels that flank the flag locations. They are facing toward a window where you can see out, but can't move forward or backward. Re-orient these so there's a clear path of movement instead. In general, all spawn points on all maps should allow players to start moving forward freely, and preferably with a clear line of sight to somewhere useful - an objective, a key area or weapon on the map, a notable piece of geometry they can orient themselves by, or all of the above. A lot of players at respawn just want to start moving forward and figure things out as they go, so your spawns should always let them do this. // Also, I am starting to feel like jetpack is a problem on this map, particularly around the bases. Is it possible to raise those outside walls enough to stop people from flying right over them? It's very hard to defend the flag because you feel like you have a grip on where people may come from - the two openings on each side, or the big open middle - and then they just fly over that wall and crap on you. Was getting very frustrated with that, since it seems like you were trying to set up specific chokepoints in a logical way and people were just bypassing them constantly. KRUS4DE: I enjoyed your first map a lot. If you can make it roomier (higher ceilings, and widen some of the areas that feel very claustrophobic) it would benefit. The design reminded me of old arena maps like Warlock and shooting across that huge upper level was fun, while you could still move pretty freely around the bottom. I didn't enjoy the second map as much, and I'm worried that as it's designed now, it will only work for unusual gametypes like team snipers. I actually wouldn't mind trying it for snipers. But for CTF and slayer I think people will just go up high and camp with the DMR, which I really hate. This game turned very stagnant halfway through; people (except me) seemed to stop even trying to move around. unrivaled - That jetpack game was weird. Good idea but I think the map could be less complicated; people aren't used to orienting themselves in a vast, 3-dimensional area in Halo, and I was just constantly hitting my head on things as I tried to fly around. I think if I were you, I'd actually push this toward even less of a conventional map design, and make it more of a big open area with perches for people to land on. // Your smash-up derby map, on the other hand, is genius. And for a quick forge it actually looked and played well. I'd suggest to orient the hog areas at an angle so you can drive on to the outer ring more safely, not pointing toward the death pits; and you may need to add the hazards that spawn in on the original derby maps (lifts would be really funny in this version). I love being a rocket guy on this; unlike the original, I directly impacted the outcome of this game several times with a well-placed blast. Juanez - you rock. Hulk - you ROCK. I have to get back to work. Sorry to the others of you I'm skipping, I've just run out of time.
I'm not going to let you, sorry! But maybe I'll add back the other 2 railings to make it more obvious that you're not supposed to be doing the thing you foolishly keep insisting on doing. Really though, there's a hole 4 units away that puts you right down on the bottom level AND is next to a power weapon drop - you can't just use that instead? Controlled chokepoints, my man: learn to love 'em. I get what you're saying, and it is annoying being radar-'naded in Halo, but the alternative is maps without any tight doorways and I'm just not going to go to that extreme. Countdown for instance was a radar-'nader's wet dream, but once you realize that's part of the strategy, you have to start finding ways to counter it - either crouch-walk in those areas, or use hologram, or get your buddy to flank for you. The problem is, I feel they're actually very useful for map flow on all other gametypes, especially flag and hill. I would prefer a hard route (a tunnel or something) between the two sides, but the built-in geometry of Ravine prevents it due to where I chose to make the map. So I'm stuck with teleporters. Maybe I'll try reverting to 1-ways though, and if you can teleport from top mid to the bottom, it would also help fix your complaint about that top mid room - you'll have another way out of it!
Not even a little bit. As to the controlled checkpoints and teleporters, of the entrances are on top that would make me feel better about it all. But, since you are keeping those narrow doors, I'll just continue to dislike that part of the map, so when you hear me complain about it in the future, just ignore it.
Way ahead of you! I'm one of those people who actually like having parts of maps that are a little campable and even a little annoying. As long as they don't dominate the whole game experience and there are counter-tactics, I think they actually add something. I know a lot of people disagree. But I find that more "perfectly" designed MLG maps, with no hard corners, no chokepoints smaller than X units wide, no lines of sight that are too short or too long, etc. - those maps are dull experiences to me. I don't want to just play DMR warz, I like the mixed experience of a map with more character. God help me, I even sometimes enjoyed battling over gold lift room on Sword Base..! But it's not to all tastes, I know. And now I really, really must get back to work, before my boss throws me out a window...
The custom thumbnails should be updated on these vids in 6 hours or less, enjoy! Recap Recap Recap Recap
SALVAGE Incredibly smooth game of flag. Games like this show me that map knowledge is essential for some people and for me. Now that i get the layout fully, it works beautifully. No criticisms really. Some times the game gets wild and frantic. I just love the binary rifle on here and personally would be sad if you removed it. But i understand that it is OP and can really stop a team in its tracks, maybe a little too well. So we will we be running some team slayer on here and some other gametypes? Or are you keeping it strictly CTF? [br][/br]Edited by merge: Tell him to **** off. Important TCOJ business.
Changes To Archway- 1. Added Proper spawn zones for CTF. Now if your flag is at home you should spawn very close to the exterior wall at Red/Blue Base, and if your flag is away you will instead spawn more toward the middle of the map usually near green or purple bases. Before it was just strictly Red side or Blue side for the spawns, but given the size of this map I think adding these zones will help, more testing needed. 2. Removed the ‘Corner’ hills in KOTH, Added additional ‘Central’ Hills to compensate. Seemed to me that whichever side the Hill spawned on in the corner that team dominated that hill, with very little resistance. So to create more of a ‘you have to fight for it’ type of feel, I moved all hills to centralized areas, Top-Mid-Bottom of Purple (Sniper), Green (Rockets) and Yellow (Bridge). Hopefully this will give both teams a chance to capture each hill and the other team a chance to steal it back. More testing needed. Yes this map with its most recent changes is in my fileshare, tho more changes are coming I'm still gonna try and comeback to leave feedback on each map sometime later...
this is the latest map i am working on, i am hoping to have it ready for the next test i can sign up for. it is based off a map i have already previewed on this site. when juanez had a look he suggested i make it a more of a vehicle based map, so i added an outside for mongeese and warthogs. i have tried to make it not complicated....really! i'm open to suggestions though, that why i am posting here i am wanting to delay spawn on the roof to make it a lot lighter inside, otherwise id have to put a grav zone across the whole thing to stop those pesky jetpackers! i'm quite liking the look of this one, but wanted to see what others thought i am unsure of what is considered safe spawn areas though... i know where initial would be, being a linear map i dont want it to turn into a spawn rape. though i suppose i could use a one way teleporter to the middle ish as a get out.
ARCHWAY I look at this map and think that it shouldnt work cos its too big and wide open. But it does work cus the line of sight blockers are so well made and the sides of the map are diverse yet safer and slower to traverse with a flag. The direct route down the middle is a whole other thing- drag the flag forward metre by bloody metre, if that is your preferred style of play. The flags are in a great spot too- open yet with several options for defence. To be honest the entire game of f trlag was a blast from start to finish. I tend to try and be the main slayer for a team during objective games so i had a lot of fun flanking and keeping the other team pressed down. KOTH was very good but as we said, the hills were a little far apart. Personally i think the problem was that the hills moved too quickly. The corner hills seemed a little too hard to attack, but then every time one of those hills popped up the other team seemed to be well set up in there by the time we arrived. Lets play some slayer on it next time. [br][/br]Edited by merge: VANDELAYi What does that name mean exactly?! This I put to you, man. When I first played this last week I was most unsure about it- like perhaps it was one of your proof-of-concept maps, just an attempt to make a map in the odd unused coliseum area of Ravine. Personally i found that if your flag was away and you got killed you spawned a long way away and had very little chance of catching up the flag carrier. I guess now i know the map i, would be able to get through quicker and catch the little thief. KOTH was good, but i didnt play the objective much, shame on me. Once again map knowledge has helped me in my assessment, allowing me to take flanking routes and move easily. Its a solid map but I dont think its as good as Bleached- that map is rock solid. I dont get the pit in the bottom of each side; it seems to spit users upwards only for them to go down in a hail of bullets. The teleports obviously work great and you said you were blocking them off for oddball, so thats that. I could stand to play this again a few more times. Perhaps it would be an idea to have a night dedicated to slayer on all these maps. [br][/br]Edited by merge: AVALON For a first test with TCOJ this went pretty good. However the map on a whole didnt seem finished yet. As a straightforward slayer map it worked fairly well, albeit very simple. The guys said something about about the roof being too low, that seemed about right. You could always look into ripping the roof off altogether to allow more light in. Dynamic lighting is great when it works for the map but when it works against it then its a bastard. I would have added more structure to the centre to increase movement. As it is, the sole tactic was push with concentrated fire and keep following the enemy teams spawn. Also as teh Dusty one said there was an annoying little gap in front of one of the bases where if you walked into it you were stuck unless you hop out again. The whole game blurred by very quickly though, so i might have missed a few ponts.
Sigh. I procrastinated to the last minute to get on and then I had a 10min update to xbox live then yall were full. I'll make it next week!
Recap Recap Here's my thoughts on the maps played this week. Sky Garden The gametype was fun and I think the most fun existed with infinite jet pack versus banshee. The KotH took away from the main idea here. I think you should further edit this gametype and make it snipers or something with added banshees. Just a thought. Rampant Revenge Holy hell this was fun. You know the changes that need to be made though. Do you care if I make a map for your gametype here? I make the geometry and then send it over to you to make trait zones and w/e else that needs to be added for this gametype but I have something I in mind here that I think would add to this. Archway I like this map and love the large circle you've developed here. I thought KotH Hill played just ok. This map works really good with CTF. Vandelay Didn't care for KotH but really enjoyed Oddball. It does become a camp fest either way though. I would stick to CTF with this one. Avalon All the action takes place on the higher outside "ring" floor. Anywhere else and you're just a duck surrounded by a bunch of hunters. Fusion Coils are overkill, got so many double and triple kills with them only by shooting one coil. Watch the video. Gulchmine I don't really know what to say here. Don't know what your intent is with the map. It's definitely a camp sniper fest. Radiant I understand you had some gametype issues here but I didn't really enjoy CTF here. Other objective gametypes are more fitting. Headlong I think the gameplay on this map is just average. I know it's a remake but the way this is remade keeps teams a lot closer and seperates them only by this big open space. It played better when it was much larger and had so much space it was impratical to BR across that open space. I know there is a budget issue but Headlong was enormous. Don't think it's possible to remake this one yet and still have the same gameplay.
Lobby for Tuesday Feb. 26th, 7 PM EST Need to know how this works? Click here to read our FAQ and rules. This lobby will be held on Tuesday February 26th, starting at 7 PM Eastern Standard Time and ending at or before 10 PM. Attendees: 1/2. Fenix Hulk 3/4. iArkitek 5/6. Tombo V1 7/8. xAudienceofone 9/10. Nutduster 11/12. TMR Legend 13/14. LEE C G 15/16. Juanez Sanchez Reserves: 1. GrenadeGorilla 2. unrivaled 3. CyborgAnthro 4. Iznel Wettham