Legendary DLC Spinach Sucks [V .2]

Discussion in 'Halo 3 Competitive Maps' started by fabioisonfire, Mar 23, 2009.

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Rate 'Spinach Sucks'.

  1. FEATURE NAO!

    7.1%
  2. Amazing.

    14.3%
  3. Really good.

    28.6%
  4. It's alright.

    35.7%
  5. It does suck.

    14.3%
  1. fabioisonfire

    fabioisonfire Ancient
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    S P I N A C H S U C K S
    [​IMG]
    By ItalyanStalyun

    Changes from version .1 to .2:
    -Added single open boxes for added cover
    -New ramp adding a second way up and down to lower area
    -2 Frag grenades added
    -Oddball and Juggernaut now supported
    -Covenant Carbine and Fuel Rod Cannon spawn switched


    S T O R Y :
    I've always loved the map Avalanche for forging- I don't know why, I just have. I wanted to create a small 2 vs. 2 floating map, so I figured that Avalanche was the perfect place. So here we have the unique map I like to call 'Spinach Sucks'.

    This map is all about wide-open spaces, and terrifying drops. A huge part of the map is keeping your footing and not falling off. Often times you'll be watching where you're going more than where you're shooting!

    Why the name? Well, I decided I wanted the map to be green. Spinach is green. I hate spinach. Therefore, 'Spinach Sucks'. It's (in my opinion) my best work ever. I've color coded everything (yes, I've gone insane) and worked it to perfection. So, after dozens of ideas, many test games, hundreds of saves, and millions of prayers that the box will go green, I give you Spinach Sucks.



    G A M E T Y P E S :
    Supported:
    Slayer
    Oddball
    Juggernaut

    Recommended:
    1 vs. 1 Slayer
    2 vs. 2 Slayer
    Free for All (3-4 player) Slayer
    Free for All
    (3-4 player) Oddball
    Free for All
    (3-4 player) Juggernaut



    L O A D O U T:
    [x1] Fuel Rod Cannon (90 second respawn, 1 spare clip, do not place at start)
    [x2] Battle Rifle (30 second respawn, 2 spare clips, place at start)
    [x2] SMG (30 second respawn, 2 spare clips, place at start)
    [x1] Covenant Carbine (30 second respawn, 2 spare clips, place at start)
    [x4] Plasma Grenade (10 second respawn, place at start)
    [x1] Regenerator (90 second respawn, place at start)

    [x2] Frag Grenades (10 second respawn, place at start)


    S C R E E N S H O T S :
    I don't quite think that the screenshots do Spinach Sucks much justice- I urge you to download before giving a critical opinion.


    Over-head view.
    [​IMG]

    Side-view.
    [​IMG]

    Front view.
    [​IMG]


    Covenant Carbine spawn.
    [​IMG]

    Lower area.
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    "Oh shi-"

    [​IMG]

    D O W N L O A D
     
    #1 fabioisonfire, Mar 23, 2009
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2009
  2. toasted kittuns

    toasted kittuns Ancient
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    i agree, spinach does suck.

    about the map, awesome stuff. color coding it green, i haven't seen that yet. i like how you got the floating platforms even. i like the map, it would be great for a 1v1 or 2v2 br warm-up, there's enough cover to hide but not enough to stay hiding. the merging is clean, which is pretty difficult outside of the map, when everything is color-coded, and grid-less. also, the design is very unique. 4.5/5, downloaded.
     
  3. ShortKidPena

    ShortKidPena Ancient
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    This map is great especially for being floating outside of avalanche. It does seem very small though, and doesn't have great cover. I could see a lot of spawn killing, but thats just me. the map is great in itself though. im going to give you a 4/5, but it needs a little improvement
     
  4. RackemWillie77

    RackemWillie77 Ancient
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    I kinda agree with the above^
    It could use some more small detail and cover.
    Good job 4/5
    P.S. Don't vote your own map.
     
  5. Dow

    Dow Ancient
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    This map is extremely lacking in cover. I don't really see the point of the wall/rail things on the side of the boxes, you cant hide behind them. As a matter of fact, I dont see ANY cover excluding the shield door at the fuel rod spawn. A map in the competitive map section is supposed to be competitive, and since you can literally see every point in the map from every other point in the map, I dont see how this could be competitive.

    Also, if you are going to rate your own map, atleast dont make the poll public, we can see who voted for what....=/
     
  6. Sotha Sil156

    Sotha Sil156 Ancient
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    This map is an ascetic beauty, but it looks more like an ascetic map than a competitive one. It has a great design, but, as said by the preceding posts, it is lacking in cover. I am intrigued by it, and will download the map, see how it plays, write a better review, and await you reply to these critiquing posts. Oh, and by the way, spinach sucks.

    The layout for the map looks great, almost like a street. I would like to see an enclosed, urban themed map with this exact layout. That would be rather cool. I would expect it to play great for the one-sided objective games. Good luck, because I will be watching.
     
    #6 Sotha Sil156, Mar 23, 2009
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2009
  7. STWOW

    STWOW Ancient
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    Kk well this does look like a good small team game I like the all green boxes and the weapon list is awesome but some of the merges seem sloppy well I'll DL
     
  8. penguin asassin

    penguin asassin Ancient
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    Maybe change the fuel rod spawn to carbine, then move carbine to the middle of the platform FR was, and get rid of the camp box. Why u may ask? Well besides fuel rod being in a camp box, the top is a much more commanding advantage then the bottom. And carbine would be more useful at the top. Maybe add some other weapons to.
     
  9. fabioisonfire

    fabioisonfire Ancient
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    I was just being an idiot while rating that, I hope everyone knows.

    They are there to act as guardrails from falling off- trust me, you'll be thankful for them during gameplay.

    I guarantee you that there's hardly any slop here.

    Thanks for the comments, everyone. I understand the lack of cover complaint, and although I wanted this map to be about wide open spaces, I'm adding some open single boxes along some of the longer paths in version .2.
     
    #9 fabioisonfire, Mar 23, 2009
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2009
  10. Insane54

    Insane54 Ancient
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    What's with people and giving 4/5's for alot of 'no cover, but i haven't played yet'

    Anyway, I really can't download your map because I'm at the 100 item limit (I'm actually in Forge trying to get a friend to save my map ATM D:). I will try to though, I hope. I'm not a big fan of this 'random cover' thing, think about Guardian; is there random boxes and columns all over the place? It works through flow, not cover. Though cover is important to a certain degree, so that you have somewhere to go when shot, think of the map in terms of flow, not cover, generally. You don't need random single boxes as long as you can flow from area to area evenly and cleanly, and have somewhere to go (preferably other rooms or areas) when getting shot. I don't like the idea of hiding, that's for Gears, not Halo. You want to make him move, and if you have good teamwork, be able to have someone on your team cut him off or flank.

    To future and past 'reviewers': IF YOU HAVEN'T PLAYED IT, DON'T GIVE THEM A FREAKIN' RATING! AHHHHHGHHHH! Even if you have, it's pretty much demeaning. Your not a critic, sorry.
     
    #10 Insane54, Mar 23, 2009
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2009
  11. C0RRUPTl0N

    C0RRUPTl0N Ancient
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    Well if you haven't seen all greed boxs yet then you obviously don't know me. My first map, OLYMPIUM, was the first all green map. And No One knows color coating sucks like me... I have the feeling that the creator of this map could have used my maps to get out here beyond the barriers, I'm going to download this and see if any of the objects that I placed in secret locations in my map are still in the map, then I will know if this is just a copy of one of mine, or if you actually just broke the barrier on your own. The map looks ok, I like it because it's the first that is made outside avalanche like all mine, and that it's color coated, but I will get a better reply after I play and see what its is like.
     
  12. fabioisonfire

    fabioisonfire Ancient
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    You HONESTLY think I copied you? Wow. It isn't hard at all to get past the boundaries, friend. It's common knowledge.
     
  13. C0RRUPTl0N

    C0RRUPTl0N Ancient
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    No, I don't care if you did. I still like the fact that somone else is making maps out here. If you haven't seen any of my previous maps you should give them a look, there all out side the barriers. I think you should work on this a bit more it's pretty small and seems like it's real easy to fall off. I like it though, it's in a good spot, Is it possible to get back to avalanche I didn't try, if so your always going to have people doing that it will get annoying. But nice little float job. 3/5
     
  14. fabioisonfire

    fabioisonfire Ancient
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    I actually have looked at your maps, and I like them a lot. The map is supposed to be small, it's meant for 2 vs. 2 and 1 vs. 1. I wanted it easy to fall off, give it that 'cliff-hanger' feel. And yes, it's impossible to get back to Avalanche.
     
  15. Sotha Sil156

    Sotha Sil156 Ancient
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    I was wondering if you knew that the barrier to the inside of the map overlaps with the very edge of the nearest walkway, forcing all who touch it to be trapped or jump off and kill themselves. I agree that the camp box should maybe be changed to something else, but maybe it's just because I don't like shield doors.
     
  16. fabioisonfire

    fabioisonfire Ancient
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    I'm aware of that one. In testing, it never really happened (other than in the heat of action when they were running off the edge anyway) so I discarded it as a very valid problem.
     
  17. stickmanmeyhem

    stickmanmeyhem Ancient
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    Woah, lucky! You got Insane to post in here! Anyways, I'm prob gonna DL to test it out before I say anything other than. Interesting Idea for the map, it looks... intriguing...
     
  18. Condawg

    Condawg Ancient
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    Wow, this looks really good.

    As others have said, the lack of cover probably takes away from the gameplay a bit, especially if it's with any more than four players, but it looks really well merged. Must have taken you forever.
     
  19. Insane54

    Insane54 Ancient
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    Alright, just played it. I had a few problems with spawns; occasionally I wouldn't be paying attention and run off the edge of the map, some of the spawns are really close to the edge. Also, most spawns face towards Avalanche, not the map. When I spawn all I'm seeing is the scenery, it makes me pause for a moment while I look around and figure out where I am. It can be tough to get this right because of the different levels of elevation on this map, but it's worth a look into. In a similar vein, I didn't really like where a bunch of them point, like at a corner that has 2 paths off it, it points towards the middle where I just fall off. Also, it needs to be pushed farther back to you have more time to realize where you are. 2-3 seconds of running straight forward if you can, thanks. There's also very, very few spawn points. I could check em all pretty quickly, not really in a 1v1 but very possible in a 2v2, I think.

    The interlocking is really smooth and looks great, but I didn't really feel any risk in aquiring a power weapon. I didn't really like how there's only one path down and no other ways back up, especially for the reward of just a regen and carbine and stickies. That generally followed throughout the map, it seemed like a straight path in general, with no ways to flank or intercept with a teammate or in a 1v1. There seemed to be no tactical jumps either to get from area to area, even a nice drop you could've used (that like thin hole between 4 double boxes) dropped into nothing, it looked like. To be honest, the lay out seemed kind of randomly decided, if it was I urge you to read up on map design and layout and plan your maps out in advanced in the future. You can really improve the way people flow in your map that way. Personally, I use Bungie maps as examples of how things should be done.

    The fuel rod area was kind of pointless, I was able to just camp in the open single box with it, with the shield door. Talking about that, the shield door isn't exactly angled right. No big deal, but figured I'd let ya know. Also, around that area sometimes I'd get stuck (?) along the side of the boxes and have to fall off. It was weird.

    I also think the BRs and some other weapons needed to be more out in the open. I didn't notice most until I looked for em.

    OK, so I've been nitpicking at stuff, and been pretty critical. You seem like a guy who appreciates constructive criticism instead of "OMG GUD" or "UR MAP SUXZ LUL". The gameplay was decently fun in my 1v1 BR game. Though I doubt you can really make this very competitive and well-flowing in a v2, I look forward to seeing maps from you in the future.

    :)
     
  20. fabioisonfire

    fabioisonfire Ancient
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    Thanks a lot for that review. You're right- I appreciate an actual review rather than the usual two to three word response.

    As for your criticisms-

    In version .2, I switched where the Carbine and Fuel Rod spawn. This helps things a lot; the power weapon is more out in the open and harder to get to, etc.

    As for the spawns, they were a severe challenge for me and still are. A lot of the time, I'd place a spawn, and when you spawn, you fly off the boundary. I'm looking for ways to get past that, and once I do, that gripe will hopefully be lessened. I agree, most of them are placed a bit too close to the edge. I never thought about turning the direction of them, though, so thanks.

    As for the hole on the main platform, it's there to fall through and die. It originally wasn't there, but in one of my test games, I accidentally forgot to spawn it, and we had a blast with it. It added to the 'don't fall to your death' feel.

    As for the layout and flow; I knew I wanted to make a kind of one-way dead-end street feel. I agree that there needs to be another way up and down, which brings me to my next point.

    In version .2, I added another structure to the end of the turn to get to the watchtower base. It adds another ramp to get up to the secondary upper platform (the camp box). It's in the rough stages, but it helps the flow of the map tremendously. I think this feature is probably going to help the map the most in .2. This picture might help describe it better than I can.

    Thanks again, I really appreciate it.


    As for the common complaint of the lack of cover on the map, I've added two single open boxes upon the main walkways, so hopefully it should quell those complaints. I'm also adding support for Oddball in version .2 as well.
     
    #20 fabioisonfire, Mar 25, 2009
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2009

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