Here's my attempt at offering some sound advice for forging. This is directed more at unexperienced/beginning forgers. When forging a new map, ask yourself "What would Bungie Do?" What I'm trying to say by this is that if you want to see some patterns that work, just load up any default map configuration. Notice a few things. 1. How many use teleporters? Answer: (Avalanche/CS Edit) 2, and zero before any DLC was released. Teleporters are never used in default maps for a reason. They are problematic. Teleporters provide rapid transportation, but can be disorienting. It's harder for a new player to get used to the space of a map when teleporters are involved, and let's face it, when you forge a map, it's new, even if a player is familiar with the dafault version. Teleporters have been wisely replaced in Halo 3 with the man-cannon. Obviously, teleporters are way cooler and sci-fi-ish (???), but man-cannons are much more functional for gameplay reasons. Bungie was gracious enough to allow teleporters to be used in forge. By all means, use them, but only when it makes sense to. And use them sparingly. 2. Objectives. Have you ever deleted all bomb spawns and bomb plants you didn't want only to find that when you reloaded your map, they had been replaced? Well, the game insists that there be a certain number of them. Look at a default map to find out how many symetrical and asymetrical objectives for attackers, defenders, and both are needed at a minimum. If this is still confusing (I still get confused by it), there is a quick fix. Say your map is only for asymetrical games and you don't want to see the symetrical spawns in forge. Instead of deleting them over and over, just hide them. They won't appear if you play the appropriate gametype. Make sure to do a test run to see if you got this right. Also remember that this will make your map unplayable on symetrical games, but if that's your intention, no prob. Edit: here is a list of the minimums that will be replaced if you delete them. CTF: 2 flag spawns, 2 flag plants. 1 of each for attackers and defenders Oddball: 1 ball spawn KOTH: 1 hill marker VIP: 1 go-to point Juggernaut: 1 go-to point Territories: 1 territory marker. make sure if you only have 1, the symmetry is set to "both" Assault: 2 bomb plants, 3 bomb spawns. same as CTF but you need a neutral spawn as well Everything else (starting points, respawn areas, etc.) can be deleted and the game won't replace them. 3. Grenades. Ever notice that on the default maps, there either frags and plasmas OR frags and spikes? I wonder what this could be telling you. Maybe after lots of play testing, Bungie figured out that games were more fun and balanced (grenade spamming, anyone?) if players were only able to carry 2 sticky grenades and 2 frags, instead of 4 stickies and 2 frags. 4. Spawns, weapons, vehicles, etc..... Just look for yourself at the defaults to see what Bungie considers to be balanced and sensable in many differant aspects. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Disclaimers A. I'm not an expert, and in many of my maps it seem that I could have followed my own advice. B. Also, obviously, the defaults are not the only resource. There is actually a bountiful collection right here on Forge Hub. Just check the featured maps section. C. I am aware that many of Bungie's "decisions" about weapons and spawn points have had their fair share of criticism. In that case, WWBD is also a great opportunity for some good jokes, and I want to hear them.
Very nice. I hate playing maps with an excessive amount of teleporters for no real reason. And grenade spamming is just not cool. Good post.
Good advise. I agree teleporters just don't fit in most maps. Ive seen them in plenty of maps and they stand out and usually look out of place.
good advice bout the grenades, also is it just me or do the grenades have different trajectories making it harder to stick. so only having one sticky makes it a little less confusing.
I agree with everything. But don't do what Bungie does with spawn points or you'll be walking into walls
There is also a really good thing to note with numbers on bungie maps. Like for example how many Grenade Spawn points on a map there is about 8 sets of 2 usually set up... 4 of each type... 6 sets on others...
omg i think i love you. you are a genius and every forger should be required to listen to you, punishable by death
I use teleporters sparingly, and grenades tend to be put in at last minute, so there's never enough. Still, I agree with all of the above. I also suggest putting in the complete awesomeness of Respawn Zones.
Thank you for taking the time to explain some of these points to our newer members. Not that I'm trying to brag, but I knew all of this already; I made my first (albeit horrible) map using Bungie's principles, and it taught me a lot about forge before I even knew about this site. If i see another map with an absurd amount of grenades or teleporters, I think I may kill myself. Or just leave the game... That would probably make more sense. --dc
I'm guessing you found this through the master index I made? any way, try not to necro-post in the future, but you posted something nice so i guess it doesn't really matter.
Pred, I think your first point needs to be updated for Avalanche. This should be included in the useful info sticky, though. As for the WWBD jokes, you should make the little rubber bracelets and sell them at gas stations.
I didn't even look at the post date. Honestly, I never really understood that rule (I didn't know it was called necro-posting but I knew of the rule). There is a lot of good info buried in some old threads, and its annoying to see someone else start a thread that contains almost the same exact info from an old thread. If the search feature were to fully be utilized, a review of this rule is definitely in order. If someone searches using the new "Tag" feature, they are likely to come upon many threads that are older than 3 weeks, but can't post in those threads due to this rule. It just doesn't make a lot of sense. Oh well, that's my two cents. I'll try to look at post dates before posting next time. Even though I don't agree with the rule per se, I will obey the rule as long as it is enforced. --dc