I really like the concept of pushing design boundaries in Forge. It sucks though that a lot of people are stuck on the whole MM ready hype when they talk about maps.
I'm not going to say black and white sketches are less valuable artistic works, but I don't feel like your maps vary line weight, shading or perspective nearly enough to justify using just one medium. There is only so many ways you can fight on an indoor room based map before you spawn on it and know exactly how it's going to play. I'm not expecting you to start making theme related maps if that doesn't interest you. But every time you post a sketch or a map, it looks exactly like your last map and I honestly wonder why you don't have dozens of them already released. In your last sketch, your power up spawn underneath the map (assuming your faded lines are underneath) appears to function similarly to the Sniper Spawn on Worthy, and both of them are in the middle of your designs. These Walls also shares a centralized bottom area. In theory, working in grayscale should let you create a wider variety of designs, so I'm wondering why you keep arriving at similar shapes. I feel the exact opposite. It's very rare that the theme on an Overwatch map doesn't make sense - and dev tools go a long way to assisting with that - but I don't think the level design is anything beyond safe and sterile in order to provide an unintrusive baseline for all of the ridiculous class abilities. They're absolutely competitive, to the extent that the're competitively repetitive. For every King's Row, there are two or three Gibraltars. I don't think most of them are bad designs, but to me, Overwatch's maps are no different from Halo 5's "competitive FPS levels". Level design tailored "strictly for gameplay" - assuming the definition is tournament gameplay - often produces the most creatively distilled designs that lack true identities aside from their parent design. I don't think everything needs to reinvent the wheel, but for a game as especially repetitive as Halo, I'd expect the level design to make up for it.
You guys will love my thematically inconsistent warp pipes then Also the EXTREME extreme extreme extreme verticality
@MultiLockOn @A 3 Legged Goat For Whirlwind/Witch Hunt/ whatever Btw, I think the way I'm going to make it more thematically consistent is making the map a sort of prison. That would mean cutting the rickity village style architecture though
I have two maps i want to do in caverns. the geometry and vibe is completely different brtween them and the only thing similar about them is that theyre both in a cavern. But once i gave them both 2v2 player counts, making gameplay different between them became extremely challenging. I could very easily make them both, but i wouldnt want to hop on one and have a similar experience to the other. I also view my maps in grayscale and i want the layouts to be holisticly different from anything else i make for that playercount. It's a mistake to rely on a palette swap to communicate uniqueness / mask familiarity.
The way I've always seen/done it, the theme of the map directly affects the architecture- in turn affecting a large portion of the geometry and the corresponding gameplay. Every forger has their own method, and mine is that once I nail the architecture I'm looking for, I can make geometry that makes sense with it. It's extreeemely obvious to me when something was skinned right over because the aesthetic doesn't compliment the layout in a particular area. Even if the gameplay is solid, this is a massive pet peeve to me. This is why I hate blockouts it's subjective? lol jk
@A 3 Legged Goat There are games that have nothing but maps with segmented layouts/atrium-room based. They wouldn't do that if they all played similarly. It's just as valid to say all maps with no walls play the same. If you think Worthy and These Walls are similar, I don't really have a response to that. I don't even know what you're trying to do here, Goat. I make the kind of maps I like. I make them the way I like. I'm not looking for forge reputation or anything of the sort. Why are you telling me how and what to forge? @PharmaGangsta1 It's basically the opposite for me. And it's why I love blockouts.
Nah. Clearly the cars use nanobot car engines and use the road as a runway. Once they hit top speed, they fly into the air spiraling to their destination. Clearly you need to brush up on your lore.... scrub
I agree all maps should be able to be stripped down to a blockout and play the same as it does with art. Does it really matter what aesthetic Narrows, Construct, Warlock or Prisoner would have on them? No they would play the same and as most of their art is very basic visually. I do agree though that with the options we have in forge now that even a basic block out should be built with some sort of aesthetic and colors to them. The floors can be the concrete with a grime texture and the walls can be stone or white wood, forerunner or even covy texture. Add a color along a wall here and there along with a color for the door frames and a few lights and the map has a simple aesthetic and easy to understand while play testing. A full same color for walls and floors with no textures makes anything dull to look at no matter how good the layout might be.
So I started a U/S hybrid layout, and realized that I kinda ripped my giant stone structure from a Reach DLC map RIP Real talk though I'll have pics up within a couple hours. I'm going for a 2b 1t base premise, and 2 bridges that activate camo or damage boost while you're on the bridges. Will also include a warthog at each base and a neutral ghost. Thoughts on the bridges working with gameplay?
im saying that your preference towards "gameplay" which amounts to one style of gameplay is stagnating your growth as a designer because the maps you posted here recently are extremely similar. And i think they are when you have paths along the exterior walls, windows to shoot through, and centralized paths to flush from the bottom. Worthy is more porous, but the basic playstyle will involve the same positioning and spawn weighting. I just find it weird that you only like one kind of design given the infinite possibilities that working without a theme would afford you. It's almost as if you have your own theme that you keep using.
Have you played These Walls? Have you even played Worthy? I'm really can't respond to this without it making me look like a ****. So I ask again: Why are you targeting me?
Don't know if it'll help you out for not but when I think of the entirety of footprints for my doubles maps, and the amount of segmentation - Can the entire map can be covered from 2 players perspectives And if not, can those two players deduce exactly where the other team is based on what's left that they can't see. If there's a lot of segmented areas they can't see where the enemy could be hunkered up or moving through, I find it bleeds into 4s territory. Imagine two players on Legion, one on the high catwalk above OS and the other on the low catwalk. You can look at the map and know exactly where everyone is. One player in Chapel in oblivion and one on the outside. If you can't see them, they're either top or bottom labyrinth. Things like that, hope it helps.
Because you've posted entire designs as opposed to isolated pictures, and i expect you as a seasoned designer to be able to have an articulate discussion about them. I spent at least 30 minutes on both of those maps in Forge and i believe i have enough of a grasp of their designs to anticipate the way they play based on your sightlines and spawn areas.
First off, **** Glacier lighting it's dog. Now that that's out. This does help. My problem is my personal tastes bleed into my design processes wether intentional or not and I tend to do too much for the count I'm aiming for. Therefore, if I aim for 2v2 it ends up being perfect for 4s. I think I'll make some blockouts that are strictly 2v2 and start playing 2v2 customs more. I'm def interested in designing for the player count, I just need more time playing it so I can design maps based on what my preferences for the count is. (Which I'm sort of unsure of ATM). Me and Box we're looking at the overscaled super early slop version of Trinity and the maps actually really dope. May attempt a block out of that nature just to get my feet wet.