I'd say since Optic is polarizing, the hate is more pronounced. Whereas Malta's issues are more apparent, so there's less debate.

I just wanna say how much I love Optic Prison. As goat said, it does need a bit of a visual overhaul but damn, it's my favourite map in the playlist. So fun, the pace is consistent and the power up concept is awesome. It's very rewarding to stack 3 or 4 of them and just wreck.

Great work purely

What are the chances that 343 can take Community Doubles and make it an ongoing community playlist that is not only permanent but that sees regular additions from the community?

I think such a playlist would really suit Doubles, as the gametype been woefully neglected in Halo 5 thus far.

EDIT: To expand on this, remember when Bungie did the Bungie Day/Bungie VS The World playlists and just threw in loads of Forge maps?

Similar idea, but with a little more thought to keep the map quality high (via 343 and cartographer interaction)

Part of the reason Optic plays at such a great, consistent pace is that all the pick-ups are on accelerated, static weapon timers. 343 did not green-light other maps to follow this model, or else we'd see faster gameplay out of them, as well. It's really strong evidence for just how much radar and dynamic timers have hurt the pacing of competitive Halo.

This.

Halo 5 is very much a 4 v 4 game, with a 4 v 4 sandbox and universal settings suited for 4s. The playlist should follow suit, especially since theres no argument of the "casual/out the box settings" thats always a debate in the esports scene. Doesnt apply here, we dont need to cater to anyone.

go for it. i actually want people to take my maps and make them look pretty. the problem is I am very stubborn to design something with.

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 22, 2016 ---

Should have put more power ups on all the maps.
Honestly, I was shocked when they didn't want it changed on my map as well.

The spawn system in Halo 5 for most of the doubles maps is atrocious. You can force spawn people into specific locations far too easily. I can't tell you how many times I spawned in the exact same two locations on most of those maps and forced people to spawn in the same said spots.

Cobalt - I love the simplicity aesthetic of the map and the cross lines of sight from room to room. There is an aesthetic to each area that is subtle. The spawn system can't be held against the creators of the maps, but this maps two major spawns were just below carbine in that corner area and the lower end of Sniper for me. Any team holding control of the top, makes it difficult to get out of the spawns easily. The carbine spawn is bad because you have to force your way out of a tight space and by the time you orient yourself to your spawn and start to move, enemy is already approaching from the top. The incline enclosed hallways width could be expanded along with the the splinter grenades room as a whole. It is a map that takes time to learn how to play which I enjoy, but isn't great for most casual players in matchmaking. Just a bit of scaling changes and spawn adjustments and it would be good. Ohh yes, it absolutely needs angled railings that don't stop you per say but bump you to let you know you might fall and die... When coming through the teleporter you have know idea what's on the other side. If a battle ensues and you strafe or jump off that teleporter, death is inevitable. If the teleporter receiver area was inset in the wall with an expanded floor for it than I think it wouldn't need the bump indicator railings.


Hangar - It's a matchmaking styled map... Plenty of aesthetics's to make it easily readable, wide enough halls to not make it feel like you are shooting only room to room and decent elevation changes. Nothing too really major to note about this map other than it plays well and you can hold out a lot of different areas. I absolutely loved the hangar out in space which I didn't notice playing it multiple times before. Those windows should have been larger to emphasize how great it looks as an environment and not just a few rooms inside a play space.


Hazard - The theme of this map looks great and many other people could benefit from taking design cues for map orientation. Same issue with spawning in the same spots over and over, except most of them aren't at a lower spawn height disadvantage to get crapped on too hard. The one spawn next to the hydraulic lift platforms is a bit of a death spawn area though in higher level play if you know how to force spawn. It could benefit from placing the re-spawn there on the higher ledge to allow movement options for a better re-spawn battle. The only major issue is several of the rooms have too many jump ups required. The catwalks above have an unfair advantage for anyone in the lower areas of those locations. I would recommend instead of having to jump multiple crates that are there - add an incline to a pseudo door in that same location with one crate jump required and then the clamber.

Malta - I haven't played a lot of matches on this map, but aside from being aesthetically bland, it doesn't play horrible. It kind of reminds me of Boardwalk gameplay from Halo 4, where you want to control the higher side. The overshield cylinder area is strange and could use a redesign perhaps. I agree it could use a drop down by the elevator. The map had a major issue with two spawn points over and over also... Not a terrible map at all, just could have used some feedback while it was being built and it would have turned out much more solid.

Optic - I think 100% of the people playing it during it's first game is WTF is this with all these power ups? I personally find it to be refreshing as each game is uniquely different on it. The overshield area is a death pit for spawning and the blue side could use a bit more of versatility in it's pathing. Perhaps an entry/exit on the lower floor where the prison door is and to the front of the blue wall upper floor out to center (closer towards the receiver portal side). The aesthetics are neat and under appreciated on the map. A few large stalactites from the ceiling or a god ray of light in would have made the atmosphere more appeasing to the matchmaking community.

Purple Reign - It has been discussed a few times about the issues on this map which aren't too many. I don't agree with one team having access on spawn to the Plasma Caster though, it should be moved or delayed spawn for that reason. The grenades on the stairs bouncing back are annoying though. Overall it is a very clean map for matchmaking, but will result in very similar game play over and over on it.


Shurima - It also has been discussed for most of it's issues. This is a map that would highly benefit from a teleporter due to it's gameplay flaws. Generally if you have to add a teleporter after to fix a map, it's layout is flawed. If you control the Beam Rifle spawn area, other players are force spawned out side of that area and it's easy to dominate the map from there. The map would benefit a change from removing any sniper/one hit weapons and focus more on power ups staggered on the map or less instant kill power weapons to promote movement and change elevations of the main rooms outer floors to a bit lower.

Do you mean blue initial or blue lighted? I have experimented with stuff before on the red lit side (blue initial) I was afraid the extra space I would have added would make it to powerful. You are aware of the jump up right at the initial spawn there on the door?

Fixed.

Answer me so I have an understanding of what you are saying. I am not mad. I just want to fully understand every possible complaint out there so if I ever make a map like it again I can avoid certain problems.

Sorry purely, the blue colored lighting side. Overshield rock is to the right of the weaker side of the bases. I do really enjoy that map though!

gotcha i get it.

Just make aysm midship already

I gave it to you. I can only make it inverse. Have confidence. You have escaped your box name. That should be more than enough freedom.

I am so confused reading this

good that was the goal.

Sorry but Malta... Ughhhhhh

i personally never had the opportunity to play Malta in the playlist yet, so I'm curious to know what the problems and proposed solutions to addressing them would be.

I just got aids playing it. You just spawn in two corners the whole game and get shot at awkward angles. I personally feel the glass creates clutter while some could disagree with me. I don't want to be on the overshield platform but that only leads to red or blue side and you just use the overpowered brs on the map. I don't feel like snipe should be on that map? My opinion. Few weird sight lines from side to side looking over the ov platform

eDit: I don't really feel like there is a good way to counter rockets. Sick campaign doors though.

Xandrith I played ur map and it was fun. Played better than I thought

There's really no quick and simple fix for Malta. The problems stem from map shape, size, and weapon layout.

The "C-shaped" design eliminates a whole quadrant of potential spawn areas, making respawns extremely predictable. And unlike Colossus (a similarly "C-shaped" map), Malta is awkwardly asymetric: Blue Side has enormous structural advantages over Red Side: high ground, a surplus of cover, and no identifiable counter-positions.

Compounding the problem, Malta's weapon layout fails to provide a single incentive to leave Blue Side. The Sniper Rifle essentially spawns at Top Blue, and with a BR that spawns close-by, this is all you'll ever need. From Blue BR, players have commanding lines of sight on the Rocket Launcher, and the fact that you can clamber from OS back to Top Blue means that dropping for OS does not negatively impact your map control at all.

I feel bad for suggesting this, but the easiest way to fix Malta would be to turn it into a symmetrical map. This type of design *needs* a centrally-located power position, ala Colossus. By deleting Blue and creating a mirror-copy of Red, the map would immediately improve. I can't promise this would make it a good map, but it would certainly play better than what is currently in matchmaking.

Other recommendations:

Replace Rockets with something more appropriate for the map.

Lower "OS" piston. Should not be able to jump from OS to top level.

Raise LOS Blocker that prevents shooting across the pit from side-to-side.

Remove the BR's from the map, or consolidate to a single BR.