Hi there, so anyways, after several glaring setbacks, I finally completed the base version of my new map, called Horseshoe. Horseshoe is a large Big Team Battle map, designed to entwine infantry combat and vehicular madness in one. It is meant to be played with 12-16 players, though I think 10 could work okay. Anyways, here are some pictures: Currently each base houses one Scorpion (150 second respawn, does not spawn at start), one Default Warthog, one Missile Warthog, and one Revenant. There is also a Ghost at a secondary spawn location. Main power weapons include 2 Shotguns, 2 Snipers, 2 Plasma Launchers, and 1 Spartan Laser. The Plasma Launchers have a longer respawn time than the Spartan Laser to encourage players to traverse to the middle of the map. There is also an Active Camo Powerup on the Man-Cannon side of the central bridge, to encourage player movement, as well as provide another way to sneak up on vehicles or power weapon spawns. This map has not been tested yet, as it was only finished just today, and it is only currently set up for BTB Slayer. I'll be testing it numerous times before its release, so if you want to help test it, please comment below or send me a Friend Request over XBL. I'm usually on at around 2PM or 8PM US Central Time. Also, everything, especially the Scorpions, are subject to change before release.
The area where them teleporter frames are is pretty open. I'd be happy to test with you. GT: Yellow Sausage
This looks like a decent start for a BTB map. There are a few things I can see off the bat that could be issues that you should watch out for in game: • The very large/ open areas next to the water pit have almost no real cover besides a few small columns and pylons. Areas above these will be able to dominate them with DMR fire, discouraging players to move through these areas. While vehicles can help pave the way through, the size of this area may cause some issues with players moving through on foot. • Some players may be put off by the size of the water pit. Grenades get caught in the water and like other parts of the map it is extremely flat and open. You may find players avoiding this area as if it was a death pit, as entering it puts the player at a large disadvantage. Other than that the map looks like it will play fairly well. Though not overtly interesting, the map looks like a good start. And God knows we need more decent BTB maps.
What would you suggest putting in the open areas? I'll most likely replace those little teleporterframe knobs with large pieces to help free up some budget and objects. I think I'll put some rocks in the water area too. There are already some supports from the bridge coming down for some cover, but some raised rocky areas couldn't hurt.
Larger cover such as Platform XL's aren't bad, but the biggest thing you should do is lag around having them. Segregating the areas a bit more with height variation or with a divider of some kind can help keep areas from being too open.
This is probably the first good BTB layout I've seen from an unknown forger. The overall layout is good but on a small scale you lack cover for infantry in most areas and subpaths for them. If you're on tonight I can go through in forge and give you some help with the cover issues.
I would have a problem sketching this too, lol. Looks pretty nice. Like a MLG BTB map. Like FS said, the infantry will stay along the perimeter of the map the whole game, which isn't necessarily a flaw, but you would like every part of the map to have its use. One important issue I noticed, was that the highest point of the map is on the side that is closer to the spawns/bases. Players should have to walk out of their way in a dangerous environment (risk) to get to the highest position (reward). The way you currently have it, the furthest point of the map does not give players enough incentive to go the distance.
Okay so it seems everyone agrees there needs to be more ground-level cover for infantry. I have a slight budget problem (lol $10 remaining) but removing the teleporter frames will net me $600 to use on replacing them and fixing some other areas. @xzamplez: I should have noticed that dammit. Right now the Spartan Laser is infront of the hut type thing. I could probably find a way to raise the far end of the bridge to match the height of the opposite side, and then move the Spartan Laser there, while moving the Active Camo into the infantry tunnel I have behind the hut. As for the man-cannon, I could probably remove that too so infantry have to fight across the bridge to move between the two highgrounds for their respective rewards. @pyro I won't be online for maybe 2 days, but if you want I'll PM you a dl link so you can check it out in Forge.
Your issue isn't so much a lack of cover, but a lack of compartmentalization. Of course this is a bit speculative; based on your screenshots, but I think you'll find it useful nonetheless. A mediocre BTB map might have a few large areas which are seperated by pieces of cover. This will work, creating sightlines that are desirable in length, allowing players to traverse the map in a fashion that can support decent gameplay, but isn't condusive to good gameplay. A good BTB map will have more areas; segmented but not separated. These areas will likely have some smaller bits of cover within them, but the areas themselves are set apart by either height variation, or some sort of dynamic sightline blockage. An example would be having two paralell areas which are set apart by a few objects (platform XLs, blocks, etc.) vs having two areas set apart by something more intrinsically part of the map (think one area tunnels through a building while the other runs along the outside of said building, perhaps there is a connection in the middle of the tunnle to the outside). Compartmentalizing maps in this way is more difficult to do from a design standpoint, but will pay off in the end. it will create areas that flow together without feeling like a single area which is broken up by pieces of cover. You can't always compartmentalize in this way, but when you can it is certainly desirable. Shifting the heights of chunks of your map, creating minor separations will be a good start. from there, try to incorporate blockage of sightlines into the map's inherent geometry rather than slapping new pieces of geometry onto it. Shoe and Pyro should be able to explain this to you further. Lastly, here is an example of this from my own experience; I recently designed and built a BTB map. While building, I was a bit nervous about a lack of compartmentalization I had. My suspicions were confirmed upon beginning to test the map. At first, I thought I could get away with adding a few more bits of cover throughout the map, but it still didn't play quite right. Now I am actually shifting entire buldings on the map to better compartmentalize the map. Oh, i almost forgot to mention. You're off to a good start. Continue refining the map with help from Shoe and Pyro (and myself if you would like), and you'll end up with a pretty nice BTB map.
Let me try to translate some of that from Duck to Shoe (a very similar language to English) for you: Currently there are a few very large areas on your map, including the water and the areas the water ramps out onto. The size of these areas, as well as the amount of places that can shoot down into them, promotes only very long DMR fights and boosts the power of snipers and tanks over these areas to the point that players will likely avoid them, knowing that their chances are better if they just avoid them. While placing cover in these areas helps solve some issues, players mostly prefer to fight without "totems," or cover pieces that the players just chase each other around. In order to prevent such large areas (or fix them without using scattered cover) the map needs to be segmented into smaller sections with large structures that help improve paths for both infantry and vehicles. Doing this also helps keep higher up perches from controlling the entire map, as they can only see the area they overlook. Here are some examples of this concept used in other Big Team maps: • Port Authority is divided into several main sections: The beach area, tunnel, center area, top base, and back alley are all divided by large building structures or through the use of tunnels. While areas can see the areas next to them, they can't see any further away, creating many connecting areas instead of one large basin. • Hivemind is a bit more similar to your map, and is segmented differently. This map has used larger walls to create what are in essence large hallways that curve to help[ block line of sight. The main concourse that divides the map blocks line of sight across from base to base. Pyro and I will get on with you in a few days when you are ready and we'll try to help you brainstorm a solution. Like they have said though, the map's not bad, but there are some things that could probably be improved.
Thanks for the help so far. I managed to get online for about 20 minutes and I raised the far side of the bridge to match the height of the area around the "hut" and moved the Spartan Laser there. I also removed the teleporter frames and made rubble piles about the size of Scorpions for infantry to move in. I see what you guys mean about separating large maps into sections. Whenever I imagine BTB when thinking about designing a map, I always envision it like a Containment style map, with a huge open area and base warfare. Hopefully Halo 4 will have a less limiting Forge Mode so I can build this with real terrain around the waterpit, but I predict that won't happen.