Pac, I think this thread may be the most I've ever agreed with you. This kind of list really has to factor contextual significance in, otherwise it'd be pointless. It has to account for how significant games were in their time and place, otherwise all they'd be left with is subjective judgements on their part. I didn't like the "let's completely disregard context" argument when I was studying, and I don't like it here either. I think the choices got very logical up near the top spots, and whilst I obviously disagree with some placements, that's to be expected and even judging on the basis of something like significance will never be clear cut. That said, I still think it's kinda ridiculous that Bioshock is at 3. Seriously, where did that come from? Yeah, it's clearly a typo. These things happen, especially when typing out descriptions for 100 games. Gotta say I'm surprised it hasn't been corrected yet though, I can only imagine the torrent of emails coming from angry Pokemon fans since it went out.
Some other snubs that could have easily been in that list, The Secret of Monkey Island (One of the most played point and click adventure games) Max Payne (introduction of bullet time into gaming) Gears of War 2 (I'm surprised Gears 3 was in the list instead when it is gears 2 that introduced horde mode, a mode that has become a staple in games since) Forza 3/Gran Turismo 3 (Either or, there wasn't a racing game in the entire list and these two sold many millions of copies and are considered by critics and fans on average as the best racing games thus far) Dragon Warrior (The first game in the Dragon Warrior/Dragon Quest series that has sold millions of copies in Japan was one of the most expansive RPG games during the 80s) Splinter Cell Chaos Theory (Said it before and I'll say it again, this game did more for the stealth genre than Metal Gear Solid) Dragon's Lair (Not so much a game as an interactive movie, it still was played enough times and is famous enough to have been remade for every console in existence)
Because A: I'm not your *****. And B: if my first thought is "G4TV is **** and Top 100 Best/ most influential/ most popular list are worse than Tauntaun ****" is my first thought, that's what i'll say because (see A). I never played Morrowind or Oblivion, but it makes me sad that the average gamer you meet on the street will put a masterpiece like Fallout 3 beneath a hype-piece like Skyrim. But like I said, the list reflects what people expect it to show, not any group's opinion.
All credibility got lost with the "Pikachu Red/Blue" errors on the Pikachu page. Although my friend on facebook was complaining how Halo 3 didn't deserve a spot at all on the list. No console game before has continued to have thousands of players play it after 5 years, and it's all because of Forge. Forge was definitely groundbreaking when it came to multiplayer games online. So much re-play value.
Great single player story, beautiful world, spaghetti western music track was excellent, and even the multiplayer wasn't that bad. Oh and the zombie DLC was one of the best DLC's to come out for a game. So it definitely deserves to be on a list of top games, again I don't like looking at the number because then people focus on that instead of the game. I'm sure anyone could argue why it should be a better number, a worse number, or not get one at all but then it's all opinion. ...again with this. The clip (you know...of the actual show), the page where the clip is on, and everywhere else but in that video description which was probably written by some intern web developer at G4 (not the X-Play people) says "Pokemon Red/Blue". No credibility is lost in the slightest unless you're the kind of person who just loves looking for typos. I agree, Halo 3 definitely deserves to be on the list. It wasn't just Forge but also Theater mode and introduction of the fileshare that are two major additions to gaming as a whole. I think when talking about Halo the community involvement and integration (playlists, forge maps getting into Halo, contests, etc) into the game is what makes Halo 3 (and Reach as a continuation of that integration) such an important game. I probably still would have switched its place with Halo CE due to the importance CE had over console gaming (not to mention it is basically the reason the Xbox exists today) but the two weren't that far apart in numbering so it doesn't bother me that much.
that's my second favorite game of all time. and ANY televised list like this one is ****, it's not a g4 thing. televised anything really, due to how commercialized it is. even the ****ing oscars are a bunch of fancy plugs. i watched this list, i was entertained, because thats all it is, entertainment. taking it seriously or defending its legitimacy is pretty stupid.
I think arguing over an opinion is far more pointless and dumb. " I'd be willing to bet the X-play staff who compiled this list know infinitely more about gaming than you do (seeing as its their job to play games, not just a hobby) so I hold their wisdom on the subject with a higher regard than you." Yeup, the list is the holy grail. Everything they say is the truth, everything they **** out is gold. It's like a bunch of Pa- I mean cool dudes work at that place. But hey, that's just my opinion. I agree with chuck on this one, you cant really defend any televised "top 100" whatevers because they rely soley upon the opinions of people other than you, or us for that matter. But it was pretty entertaining.
At the same time dismissing it just because it is a "televised" list is just as stupid. So the only difference between a list like that being compiled say on a forum or amongst a group of friends is so much better than a list made by a bunch of friends/gamers who happen to work for a television network? How commercialized it is? Yes there are commercials, yes the network okayed the show with the purpose of it making them money by having people watch it, why people continue to dislike how business works and assume things shouldn't happen because money is involved is beyond me, everything you like is commercialized. This forum exists to make whoever owns Halo more money. As I said before, the list was made, it can't be unmade just because people dislike A)The people who made the list B) The network who aired the show C) The style of the show All of those factors have nothing to do with the content and just shows extreme personal bias to anything outside your own likes and prejudices. I have become increasingly more annoyed with G4 as the rest of you due to their lackluster program line-up and lame hosts for stuff, but that doesn't mean I automatically dismiss content when it is there. Shuman keeps saying "it is what people expect to be on a top games list", well you know what, it isn't. People expect different things. He even said it himself his feelings toward fallout 3 vs skyrim. Well if he has a different idea in mind for where games would go than everyone does and like it or not these lists are a good way of reminding people about good games. EVEN if you don't agree with the numbering or have weird ass proclivities toward things shown on television or other people telling you what they think is better, it is tough to disagree with the games on that list being there. Sure people are quick to say what should be lower or higher up but I haven't heard anyone yet give a good reason why something shouldn't be on the list. Which is usually a good sign that the list was pretty well made and not just filled with mainstream games. If it was then 1-10 would have been the latest games from the largest publishers with all sorts of commercials thrown in for those publishers. And shannon if the thread's name was "So how much do you hate G4" then your opinion would have been welcome.
Doesn't matter. Everyone's opinions should be welcome when it's a discussion thread, regardless of how much it differs from yours. Pac, it's a common occurrence in this forum for you to go out of your way to attempt try tell another person's opinion that they are wrong, which is simply retarded. You need to understand and accept that other people are going to have a different opinion than you on numerous things in life, and the sooner you accept this the better you will perform in a work place.... and life I guess. I'm not dismissing it because it's televised, I'm dismissing it because its a sack of **** from a network whom I've known before is a sack of ****, this just further exemplified their sack of ****-ness. At the end of the day though, I can care less about this list. It's their opinions, not mine. sure they played more hours of games than I have, but to say they are more aware of what makes a game more enjoyable to me is retarded.
Like that thing at the bottom of y our fridge that you're too lazy to get out because it's rotten. Kinda like that.
Those are pretty valid points, and I do agree with them to some extent. I was actually strongly moved and immersed into the story once the ending came by because the storytelling was excellent (however, I think it got a bit overdone because you would live out some really mundane conversations and moments at points). The main problem that I have with campaigns in GTA and RDR is that I feel like you spend too much time riding around on horseback/cars to the extent that I feel that about 90% of the game is riding to missions, the other 10% is the actual action and combat of the mission. I guess my problem with the game is that I haven't spent as much time with things like multiplayer and exploration as I should have. I think the same problem could possibly be found with a lot of the paid employees making these reviews/lists; their jobs tell them to move on to the next game, forcing them to turn a blind eye to some of the best aspects of the game that they're currently playing.
Whoa did I read this correctly? I didn't think you'd outright call this a "Pacmonster's opinion and those that agree with it thread" after all the bullshit you've been arguing about, but you just got pretty damn close. Seriously, what the hell were you thinking making a thread like this if you were just going to shoot down contradictory opinions? So I guess every thread you start useless arguments in, the OP could've just come in and said "your opinion isn't welcome here" and that would've been it? You would've just dropped it? Or were you operating under the very valid assumption that hey, every thread here is a discussion thread and opinions are opinions and could be expressed as such. Because if it was the latter, again, what the hell were you thinking? Opinions are opinions. Get over it for ****'s sake.
that's how i felt about GTA IV for sure. i only got about halfway. i think the thing about it is you have to be completely into the characters and story (which wasnt hard in RDR for me, that **** was so well put together imo) to truly get into it and see the "go here, do this" gameplay as something more. After a while in RDR i didnt even feel like i was going and doing missions, i did things because it felt like what i had to do. It didnt hurt that the gameplay was a ton of fun. for me, key moments in that game ended up having more emotional impact than most videogames, even more than most movies for that matter.
It wasn't a contradictory opinion. That's the point. Contradictory would have been, "you think this game would should have bla bla bla, I disagree and here's why". That opinion was stating the lack of one saying the point of the thread is pointless. Yes, I acknowledge that's an opinion. It's an opinion that doesn't help anyone nor anything. No one is enriched from knowing you think lists are ****. Great, this thread is about a list. I don't go into threads you make and say, I think threads about this topic are ****. You know why, because that's subverting the topic. You aren't saying the the thing the thread is about is ****, your saying the purpose of it is. Discussion is not that hard an idea, it has points and counter points. It breeds further discussions and gives depth to what people think, how they think about the things they think, why they think as they do. Coming into a thread and saying **** sucks is the worst kind of opinion because it doesn't do any of those things. Why does it suck, why do you think as you do? Christ, if conversation is so damn difficult to have between people why even bother being online? Have you seen me "shoot down" people who have made real discussion points in this thread? No, you know why, because even if I disagree with what they say, they explain why they said it and I can see where they come from. "This is ****" is flamebait, not conversation. Plenty of have shared ideas that are not my opinion and I'll have a back and forth with them as to why they think as they do and I let them know why I think as they do but what do you say to,"this is ****, everything is ****"?
That's a nice opinion on my opinion. Look at this cool discussion we're having here now. Love this thread.