Occupy Wall Street protesters mop, scrub as park cleaning deadline nears - CNN.com Good Guy Protesters
'Occupy Wall Street' -- It's Not What They're For, But What They're Against | Fox News The Fantastic Success of Occupy Wall Street | Immanuel Wallerstein Cop punches Occupy Wall Street protester: The whole world is watching! | City Brights: Harmon Leon | an SFGate.com blog Worldwide demonstration: Occupy Wall Street-inspired protests spread across Asia – The Express Tribune "Times are changing" - Bob Dylan - YouTube edit:
(quote from another forum) Oberman shares OWS demands - blatent abuse of powers and citizens! Disgusting! - YouTube Occupy Sacramento: Bakari citing O.W.S. demands at State Capital (10/15/11) - YouTube OWS: Protesters Give Their Demands to Reporter - YouTube
What do you guys think about this proposal floating around Facebook and emails? ""Warren Buffett, in a recent interview with CNBC, offers one of the best quotes about the debt ceiling: “I could end the deficit in 5 minutes,” he told CNBC. “You just pass a law that says that anytime there is a deficit of more than 3% of GDP, all sitting members of Congress are ineligible for re-election. The 26th amendment (granting the right to vote for 18 year-olds) took only 3 months &8 ...days to be ratified! Why? Simple! The people demanded it. That was in 1971…before computers, e-mail, cell phones, etc. Of the 27 amendments to the Constitution, seven (7) took 1 year or less to become the law of the land…all because of public pressure. Warren Buffet is asking each addressee to forward this email to a minimum of twenty people on their address list; in turn ask each of those to do likewise. In three days, most people in The United States of America will have the message. This is one idea that really should be passed around. Congressional Reform Act of 2011 1. No Tenure / No Pension. A Congressman collects a salary while in office and receives no pay when they are out of office. 2. Congress (past, present &future) participates in Social Security. All funds in the Congressional retirement fund move to the Social Security system immediately. All future funds flow into the Social Security system, and Congress participates with the American people. It may not be used for any other purpose. 3. Congress can purchase their own retirement plan, just as all Americans do. 4. Congress will no longer vote themselves a pay raise. Congressional pay will rise by the lower of CPI or 3%. 5. Congress loses their current health care system and participates in the same health care system as the American people. 6. Congress must equally abide by all laws they impose on the American people. 7. All contracts with past and present Congressmen are void effective 1/1/12. The American people did not make this contract with Congressmen. Congressmen made all these contracts for themselves. Serving in Congress is an honor, not a career. The Founding Fathers envisioned citizen legislators, so ours should serve their term(s), then go home and back to work. If each person contacts a minimum of twenty people then it will only take three days for most people (in the U.S.) to receive the message. Maybe it is time."
EDIT: That ^^^ will never happen, far too extreme. You have to compromise to win in this country. They fell victim to one of the funniest protest blunders of all time! First is "I don't get what I what so I am gonna go on a hunger strike, maybe my being un-satiated will change their minds!" And only slight lesser known, "I am poor so rather than working to change my lot in life I will stand around and whine about it on wall street!" If you get either A) the point of this or B) the reference, you win an internet inversely proportional to the amount of time and the involvement of Google.
i know my history knowledge isnt the greatest, but as far as i recall, this country wasnt founded on compromise...
Ummmm... You shouldn't rule out the possibility of this not happening. Look at the immense growth of this movement.
im not trying to single you out by saying this, Reflex, but im just using part of your post as an example... it seems the general attitude of a lot of the people i talk to about this is sort of a "meh, things will never change." view. they see the system as a thing that is unchangeable and i dont blame them because it has been ingrained into every part of our lives since birth. im usually not an idealistic person, but just think how much potential this movement could have if people would just simply believe in it. imagine how powerful it would be if all of the people who support it from their facebook page would actually go down to the protests and add their voice. i know it just seems corny as hell to say, but we really could have the power to change the way things are run. anyway, thats my 2 cents about that.
Yeah, I agree it would be cool for change and the spirit is there, but I disagree with both the end AND the means. I don't see myself getting behind it ever. Taking money from one group of individuals is simply retarded, so higher taxes on the rich doesn't quite follow in my mind. On the other hand, tax loopholes, evasions, etc, all piss me off. It should be a flat rate, and whomever invented tax breaks should have their name stricken from history. On top of that, semi-violent protest is incredibly immature. Childish even. If the word violence can be applied, it is the wrong way to go about it. There are two possibilities; one is having a nice, friendly conversation involving the use of logic and reason to persuade a group, maybe a petition outlining some requests. When the word request turns into demand, I take fault. When a friendly chat turns into a large group of people interfering with another groups livelihood, I see even immaturity. If you want someone, you work for it. Standing around, complaining, and being a nuisance is NOT working for it. However, Titmar, the current world order has just about run its course. Within our lifetime we will see global revolts, confusion, panic, old superpowers falling and new machines rising, chaos, and a new world order or two. Think post-French Revolution mania. I don't claim to be omniscient, I claim to be able to predict patterns that are obvious from the past. Do I think this could be the start of that? Undoubtedly. Do I think it will change anything in the current system? No. They demands are too extreme, and will stay that way as the protest either dies or turns into the inevitable rebellion, at which point they will get more and more extreme until it collapses, and a more conservative regime takes over again. Bam, ****ing history. Happens every day.
Are you kidding me? Do you think these incredibly rich businessmen who have no problem exploiting the middle class will care about hearing the protesters "requests"? The only way to get something done when you don't have money is through force. Not violence, but just being annoying is enough. I would say a bunch of dirty hipsters camping in the park next to your building for weeks is pretty damn annoying. It's easy to just sit at home and say this will never work or that this is the wrong way to go about it, but the difference between you and them is that they are out there doing something. Whether or not it's the best plan, at least they are doing something. If you're not going to join them, at least be supportive and positive.
Why would I be supportive OR positive? I disagree with their means AND motive. I can say without a doubt that these proposed changes would help my personal situation immensely, but I can't agree with them. Without wall street our economy is nothing. Our country falls into ruin, our pride is crushed, we are nothing. Money is not worth a failing country, in my eyes. The deal that Shanon posted, I completely agree with that. Its going about things in a peaceful manner, merely a list of requests. And its directed to the correct audience, it gets people riled up; it's great. But it is far too extreme. "Hey guys who are voting on this, you basically just have to fire yourself to pass this bill." Yeah... not gonna happen. I just especially disagree with their means, because 'annoying' somebody into giving you want you want is... childish. It is very much the same as when your little brother whines and follows you around all day because you won't drive him to get candy.
"semi-violent" protests? isolated incidents. 99% (pun not intended) of these have been peaceful protest that escalate into violence due to police brutality. people are being dragged out of crowds, beaten, maced and arrested for no reason... but you prove my point by being stuck in that mindset... thats exactly how this supposedly mystical "they" wants us to think. like we are stuck with this, change is too big and will never happen, so we might as well all bend over and take it. over the years we have all become sheep, and im guilty as charged too. also, its not all "dirty hipsters" although the mainstream media continues to only portray the idiot hipsters with witty signs instead of showing the intellectual exchanges that i witnessed when i went there. also, their demands are not simply related to taxes. they want an entire change in the system. its been argued that this is one of their huge weaknesses, because they do not have a set list of demands. its a somewhat vague message sometimes, depending on where you get your information. its true, these people dont know exactly what they want. they aren't economics experts. all that we know is that we are very unhappy with the current system, and that we demand change. the government / banks should be offering suggestions to their people of how they can help, instead of expecting a group of average people to solve the economic crisis.
No one is clamoring for Wall Street to disband, Ion. Don't judge the movement based on a few extreme cries that are obviously impractical. Personally, I support it because I understand that corporations have far too much control over out political system, a system which has stagnated due to politicians than only want to appease the lobbyists and donors that keep them wealthy and in office. I'm far from a liberal, but even I understand when drastic, meaningful change is necessary if we hope to see any measure of significant progress. There's no reason you can't also support the movement for equally down-to-earth reasons.