Hey guys. I forged up a new version of this map to invigorate it a little and to reflect MLG's recent changes in v2. So here is a list of changes for this new version: - Sniper Rifle replaced by Grenade Launcher. Sniper Rifle was mainly used for no-scoping due to the nature of the map. It's just not a Snipey type of map. Plus the Grenade Launcher works beautifully with the geometry of the map. - Armour Lock replaced by Jetpack. This is simply to reflect MLG's settings, also it provides a route from bottom-mid to top-mid. - Hologram removed. Again, to reflect MLG's settings. - Needle Rifles at the teleporters have been replaced by DMRs. Rather than just place extra ammo at the base, I decided it would be better to provide a secondary weapon. - DMRs under at base tunnels have been replaced by Needle Rifles. See above. Also, DMRs look nicer than Needle Rifles when next to frag grenades. - Plasma Pistol moved a little, to where the Hologram used to spawn. It brings the Plasma Pistol into game a little more and fills the void left by the Hologram. - Loadout cameras moved a little They should now show the same preview. - Now supports Assault - Now supports Territories - Renamed to "Hive" Thanks to all who have played it and given great feedback. I <3 you all. Copy/Paste from MLG Forums: Ok, the name is placeholder, I just like to give maps random names until I get a good title. If any of you guys would like to suggest a better name, I'd really appreciate it. This is a very basic, simple map that I designed primarily with Team Slayer and CTF in mind. Youtube Gameplay Demo >> Download << The goal was to create a small, symmetrical CTF map, that wasn't the typical Midship format of two bases, two control points and an open middle. Instead, it began as a 4-way map with a central plaza that connected all sides together in a winding fashion. That eventually evolved into a symmetrical map with a long hallway running down the side of map (similar to Pit). The layout is very simple and intuitive. Within 30 seconds of loading it up you should know the overall layout reasonably well. There's plenty of height variation. There's very little cover, so your placement and movement is key. You need to always plan an escape route rather than hiding behind a door or something. There are many open areas with large sight lines that suddenly could turn into tight hallways and blind corners to keep the gameplay interesting and exciting. You really need to be aware of where everyone is so you aren't caught out in the open. The top of the map is very open, but has superior vantage points, while the bottom of the map is the complete opposite. But I'll let the pictures now give you a feel of the map General Layout Pictures: Shotgun Side of Red Base: Top/Middle: Hologram/Sniper/Gold Side: Red-Base Bridge: Cross-Map-View: Sniper Spawn (Bottom Gold): Hologram Spawn (Top Gold): Armour Lock Spawn (Armour Lock Room): View from Gold Side of Blue Base: I hope this thread hasn't violated any forum rules, if so, I apologise. And I'd like to thank Feign (Nick) for all his input and arranging many 2v2s. (Note: This map is really fun for 2v2s, if you want to test the map but can't manage 4v4s, I'd recommend it). If anyone has any good names for the map, I'd also like to repeat that I'm all ears. I've found no Framerate issues although I haven't tried maximum of 4v4s yet. There is very little to this map, and the sightlines aren't massive, so I think it should be fine performance-wise. I'll try to get some gameplay up but I currently have only 1 Render Minute and no capture card. I'll edit when I have something. (Edit: Added) Gametype Support: Team Slayer Team Oddball CTF (5 Captures) Neutral Bomb (5 Detonations) 3 Plot Territories Pickups 4x DMR (one at each sender node and one at each gold corridor ramp) 8x Frag Grenade (two at each end of gold corridor and each shotgun ramp) 2x Plasma Grenade (bottom mid, either side of central column) 6x Health Pack (one on each face of the same central column so you can drop down from any angle, and one at each base) 3x Needle Rifle (one at each base and one bottom gold) 2x Pistol (one above each base) 1x Plasma Pistol (above gold) Power Items 1x Jet Pack (teleporter reciever room) 1x Shotgun (above reciever room, no spare clips) 1x Grenade Launcher (middle of the gold corridor, below Plasma Pistol)
downloaded and tested! wonderful map, me and my friends loved to play on it. simple symmetrical map, man i missed such maps^^ also i loved where you placed the health pacs!
From the video and the pictures it looks like the gameplay would be awesome! It reminds me of a map that would have been on 007, I like the enclosed feeling I will download and see if there is anything I would change, but I highly doubt it! Great job! n_n
I really like it! It's simple, but easy-flowing. The line of sights are really good, i'm a little skeptical on the shotgun clips. Maybe lower the ammo? But it's really fun to play and has a good feeling about it!
First, your map is not true to MLG settings. MLG does not use a Plasma Repeater as a weapon in their game types. What's up with the random health packs? I understand their decorative but none of them are easily accessible and there's only supposed to be 2 per map in accordance with MLG rules. The map is rather small even though that's your intention. There's no one control point which is a good and bad thing. With practiced teams you'll get organized pushes and controlled areas (blue, red, yellow). With pick-up matchmaking teams you're going to get chaos. Due to the size of the map I don't think a sniper really works. There was too many times I was subjugated to getting sniped from a player I couldn't see. I think Hologram is a great fit this map but Armor Lock has to go. In a map this small, Armor Lock works as a damage magnet and does more harm than good for the team wielding. It was makes the game unbalanced if a team has both AAs. I like the jump ups to top mid that are on each side. Those are nice little touch, intentional or not. The halls could use more cover than just the bumps. Without sprint in MLG you don't have a fast get away so you need to be negotiate and work with cover to escape battles. The spawning is also kinda uneven. There was about 4 times in a single game which I spawned behind my opponents and got an easy assassination. Lastly, the strut-objects really serve no purpose other than to identify the base. They're not even aesthetic. Give them some kind of purpose. They'd make excellent cover. Overall, I'd give the map a 6/10, disregarding it's non-compliance with MLG rules.
"Although some weapons did not make it into this version of our Game Types, that does not mean that we have completely excluded them from future testing". MLG isn't set in stone, I chose weapons that made sense. The Plasma Repeater is a good support weapon but it's not going to affect the game that much. It's not exactly a power-weapon. It's more akin to the Plasma Pistols that were used in Halo 3. "The logic behind that: Health packs recharge your shield. It's not cool that someone who has taken more hits is allowed to recharge their shield instantly simply because their health is in red, while another person who can strafe better, has to wait patiently with his shields down. So the placement of health packs forces you to sacrifice your height advantage in order to grab one. It slightly makes up for the shield regeneration, by penalising you in another way, and also gives you pause for thought before you waltz on over to that healthpack." Also, I didn't read anything about limiting Health Packs but I may have missed it. Do you have a link? Wouldn't the number of Health Packs depend on the map's size? I have a lot in the middle, not for decoration, but so you can grab one from any angle at top-mid. They respawn so quickly that it doesn't matter how many there are. All that matters is where they're located, in order to make players gravitate to them. I wasn't trying to build a map where the best strategy is to set-up in one spot every single game. The whole point of the layout, lack of cover etc. is to promote movement, not camping. There's a huge corridor running down the gold side of the map. That's what the Sniper is for. How? If they can see you, you should be able to see them. As a team, you should locate the opponent Sniper not only so you can take him down, but also so you don't get picked off. How is it any different to Sanctuary having a hologram and two Jetpacks? I don't understand. How is it unbalanced if a team has both AAs. Explain this please. I added a "ladder" to the Sniper Rifle spawn location. That provides another way to reach the top of the map, and it makes the long hallway less of a death trap because the exit doesn't have to be bottom mid. I don't want people hiding to escape battles. The whole point of the map is about movement. A good player will always plan an exit route and position himself in the best location for survival. The open areas have no cover for a reason. I wouldn't put cover in the corridor for the same reason Bungie wouldn't put cover in The Pit corridor or top-mid on Lockout. They are choke points. I don't know what you mean by uneven, but if you are spawning behind people, that is a problem and something I'll watch out for in any tests I run. They do provide cover... It's there to provide cover for when you spawn on either side of it. That is it's purpose. Lastly, thanks for posting. Although I don;t think your expectations match my specific goals with this map, I'll take everything you said into a account. The main thing is the Plasma Repeater, I may just get rid of it because it serves little purpose. I'm not too worried about it though. And spawning. I've not tried a 4v4 yet, so I will need to play a large game and see what happens spawn-wise. If you still have the saved film of the game you played, I'd really appreciate it if you could upload it to your fileshare so I can take a look.
First and foremost: Official MLG Halo: Reach Settings v1.1 | Major League Gaming I understand your desire to create variation within MLG gametypes and maps but your work won't get taken seriously if you decide to go against MLG rules. I know it isn't "set in stone" but your map should comply with their current set of rules and be updated as they updated their specifications. The plasma repeater requires a larger luck factor than skill since it is automatic weapon with a high variance of shot location. An excellent replacement would be the Plasma Pistol. It still a weapon that drains a shield faster than it actually kills and requires skill to use. MLG's main goal is to eliminate as much entropic factors as possible and automatic weapons are high up there on the list. Your reasoning for the health packs is inane. There should be 2 per map, at an easily accessible height. No sacrifice of position is required. Furthermore, most people who play MLG are able to 5-shot with a fair amount of consistency - and I'm not even taking into account team shooting - so 2 health packs is more than enough. They're usually located in the player's spawning base. So one in red, one in blue. The reason having Armor Lock and Hologram won't work in comparison to Sanctuary is because Sanctuary uses set spawn locations designated for teams (at least for CTF). Each spawn location gets a jet-pack so for all intents and purposes each team gets a player with the jet-pack AA and then battles over for the hologram. I forgot to mention it in my first post but the teleporters seem really out of the way. I used them maybe once or twice and only because I happened to come upon them. They're relevant but need to be brought closer in. I still feel that snipe doesn't work on this map and that the hallways require cover. The Pit halls were not this long so cover was not required. My rule-of-thumb is that if you can just barely 5-shot a fully shielded player while he runs from location to location then the distance is suffice with cover. Otherwise, you make a choke point that always results in a who-sees-who-first battle.
I used that very page to determine my weapon layout and respawn times. Just because it says each map has 4 DMR pickups, it doesn't say it must have 4 DMR pickups. There is a subtle but key distinction. I have stuck to the MLG sensibility and overall goal. My map also is being taken seriously on their website by a few forum-goers. One person loves the idea of losing your height advantage to recharge your shield. How is it going against the rules? Different maps require different weapon layouts. For instance, mine has 3 Needle Rifles instead of 4. I'm not going to squeeze another one in just because that page says each map has 4. My map is smaller. That isn't a list of "rules", so much as it is a list of what's on each map. They only have the list for "All Maps" because it's simpler than copying and pasting "4 DMRs" for every map. But for maps that have differences (like Plasma Pistol discrepencies between Sanctuary and Countdown), it lists that particular weapon on a per map basis. I will probably replace the Repeater with a Plasma Pistol in a future version though. You can't just say it's inane and repeat yourself if you want to convince me. Recharging your shields prematurely is a real problem and this fixes it. It's still possible for a team to get 3 Armour Abilities though. It's also possible for a team on Reflection to monopolise both Armour Abilities. You didn't answer my question about why it would be bad in the first place, I'd be interested in knowing why it's unbalanced. Personally, if a team can control Armour Lock and Hologram successfully, they should be rewarded for that. You need top-control to keep Hologram to yourself, and Armour Lock can be contested simply by going through the portals. They're worth visiting for a Needle Rifle, and if your team has control, then it's also worth visiting for Armour Lock. If your team isn't in control then you can still waste Armour Lock so your opponents don't get it. Also, bear in mind CTF. I don't want you to be able to grab the flag and then instantly teleport to the middle of the map. It's intentionally a little out of the way. If you don't find yourself visiting there too much then it'll be because you don't want to go bottom-mid. The gold side route leads to top-mid which is a superior position. Similar to on Midship, you usually want to go Pink tower rather than Carbine. The sniper hallway has ramps that make it hard to see to the other side. If you want to take cover, then put a ramp between yourself and your opponent. Like I said, my goals are to promote smart positioning, rather than running for cover and possibly hiding. And thanks for your continued feedback. If I sound argumentative, please bear in mind that I simply want to press you for details and reasons that I haven't been convinced of yet. You could have very legitimate reasons for saying what you do, it's just that I don't think our ideas have converged on agreement yet, but they could for all I know.
These are just my feelings on the map. If you want to keep it the way it is that's fine. You'd need to run hundreds of 4v4 with players who know the map to really get an understanding. I think the health packs are flat out silly. There should only be 2 per map at an accesible location like in the spawning base. This causes players to retreat and give up postion as well and makes much more sense. The reason for MLG having the same amount of weapons on every map is to promote movement. I cannot stress it enough that you should strictly follow that amount. I suggest removing the sniper and placing a grenade launcher instead. That weapon is ideal for this kind of close quarters map.
Looks like a pretty good map, I think i'll download. I think Beehive sounds like a good name (because of all the yellow). Plus, it sounds more "MLG" than Mango does.
This map is extremely fun to play on! I just happened to pop into your testing session the other day, and i had a blast playing on this map. There was the occasional bad spawn though. Players would often respawn in their base, right after i had just killed them and was about to walk away with the flag, when suddenly, there they are again right next to me after i literally just got done killing them. Besides that issue, which i am hoping that you have addressed, this map is completely excellent. It has a simple but effective layout that works well in highly competitive play. The only other thing that sucked was getting completely and utterly pwned by you guys, lol.
Cool, thanks for the suggestion. I renamed it as I just updated it to version 2. It's now called "Hive". Here's my update post from MLG forums: Hey guys. I forged up a new version of this map to invigorate it a little and to reflect MLG's recent changes in v2. So here is a list of changes for this new version: - Sniper Rifle replaced by Grenade Launcher. Sniper Rifle was mainly used for no-scoping due to the nature of the map. It's just not a Snipey type of map. Plus the Grenade Launcher works beautifully with the geometry of the map. - Armour Lock replaced by Jetpack. This is simply to reflect MLG's settings, also it provides a route from bottom-mid to top-mid. - Hologram removed. Again, to reflect MLG's settings. - Needle Rifles at the teleporters have been replaced by DMRs. Rather than just place extra ammo at the base, I decided it would be better to provide a secondary weapon. - DMRs under at base tunnels have been replaced by Needle Rifles. See above. Also, DMRs look nicer than Needle Rifles when next to frag grenades. - Plasma Pistol moved a little, to where the Hologram used to spawn. It brings the Plasma Pistol into game a little more and fills the void left by the Hologram. - Loadout cameras moved a little They should now show the same preview. - Now supports Assault - Now supports Territories - Renamed to "Hive" Thanks to all who have played it and given great feedback. I <3 you all. (I think rjgladysiewicz might like some of the changes if he's still around). [br][/br]Edited by merge: Did you pull the flag before or after they spawned? If it's the latter then oh dear (although I did put some extra CTF spawns down to fix issues like this). If it's the former, then it's no biggie. You can slay the enemy if you get them into a spawn trap before grabbing the flag, but when it's pulled, they should start spawning in other locations out of harm's way.
Looks fun from the video Ill dl and check it out, RJG calm down man lol. IDK bout snipes and nade launcher would be fun to bounce around in there. IMO armor lock is ridiculous but that's up to you. Add me for testing and customs. drummerboi420
Sorry for any confusion but the Sniper Rifle and Armour Lock are gone. Also, add me if you wish (and say about the map etc. because I occasionally get random FRs and my list is near full), it's the same gamertag as my name here. I never have many people online to test with and I don't get on that often either. =/