Shogun v6 Longshore Weapons & Equipment List: - BR x2 - Shotgun x1 - SMG x2 - Carbine x1 - Overshield x1 Gametypes Supported: - Team Slayer (1v1 max) - FFA Slayer - Oddball - Speedball(1) - King of the Hill (1)- Sppedball is a FFA or Team Oddball game. It gives points for holding and 2 points for a kill with the Oddball. Everyone has lower sheilds and shotguns and has proven to be quite fun. Map Details - Recommended players - 1v1 Shogun takes place in the center building on the map Longshore. These rooms have been changed heavily to balance gameplay. If you saw the Map Preview thread then you'll know after seeing the finished product how much it's changed. I've played a good amount of games on it and more the most part, has played very well. I wouldn't recommend going over 1v1 or things just get a tad crowded. Without further wait, here are some pictures: Download Shogun v6
send me a friend request, id like to play on this map with you. TitanFugo is my gamertag and i like the tactical sword spawn and the oversheild. definetly be dl-ing this
Finally! A map on Longshore. Been waiting for one of these for a while. Anyway, the map looks pretty good. I think it's...odd that you chose to use the middle building on Longshore, but from the pictures alone, I think gameplay should be interesting. I'm also digging that tactical sword jump. Nice map. Also, MOAR LONGSHORE
The pictures really don't do it much justice, and they also don't capture all the playable areas of the map either. I don't know the callouts for Longshore but I can try to describe the rooms. Center Room (Large room that connects to freezer and both sides of the level). Smaller room that has the staircase leading to the bridge. 1st hallway that leads to the original sword spawn. 2nd hallway that connects up to the room shown in picture 3. Hmm... i might have just made that even harder to understand. Anyways, regarding your want for "moar longshore" i do have a prison map in the works and should be done soon.
This looks great, i love small 1v1 maps and this looks amazing. the overshield spawn looks awesome and the hallways are good aswell. 5/5
Almost 300 downloads! Thanks to everyone who downloaded the map and please address any problems you find. Also, the aesthetics on some of the newer additions aren't as good as the original parts of the map due mainly to item limits.
Have not been on forgehub in ages, Anyway this looks pretty mad for a 1 vs 1 game you might have to invite me sometime GT Combat P3nguin ill have a game with ya. I really like the main room it justs looks like something different that other creators don't really worry about you have created some fine looking structures.
Huh, this looks pretty interesting. I'm gonna download it and check a few things in the pictures, then come back and tell you how I think the map plays and spawns and stuff. I beleive that I can see several grenade traps but sometimes those are usefull and I beleive that might be what they are. Looks really good though, I'm hoping it is as interesting as it looks.
Over 1,300 downloads. Hope everyone who downloaded is having fun. I have been informed that there are spots that you can escape from and I am working on fixing it as we speak.
I like how you used the center of Longshore to map a map, should be intersting, but i cant dl( Bungie server) Ill try it later, but from the pics seems okay 4/5 for now... Oh ya, what are the man cannons for, design? Just wondering why they were on two of the stairwells.
Over 1.700 downloads!! I hope everyone who downloaded the map is having fun. I just want to say that i am currently working on two fixes for this map. The first is that there is an area which you can grenade jump and get out. The second is that some of the fixes i made for v4 blocked the Oddball spawn so you can't even pick the ball up. I am running low on usefull items and will try to fix these problems as soon as possible.
Enjoyment: While it wouldn’t be fair to say that Shogun wasn’t fun to play on, it was just a different style than I’m used to. It was obvious from the beginning that the creator likes the close quarters frantic play style, which is something I’m not particularly fond of. Leaving my bias aside Shogun is a map that wouldn’t be for everyone, but still fills a niche that certain players might like. A heavy close quarters map with some unusual use of scenery and routes creates a mildly enjoyable experience, even for those of us that prefer to have some space to breathe. Aside from some spawning issues and some breakability issues that I will discuss later Shogun comes close to being an average enjoyment, while requiring a certain style of play that not everyone might enjoy. Shogun receives a tenth of a bonus point for putting a box in front of the “Do Not Block” door. Balance: While it is difficult to really say that the map was unbalanced, it did have a few strange areas. The first that bears addressing is the spawning. I’m not sure how this could even be fixed in such a small map, but the spawning is 3v3 was rather… awful. I don’t think this map should be played above 2v2 or would probably be best suited to be used as a 1v1 map. Too often you spawned directly above the enemy or in the same room as them, which can be quite annoying at times. Even when you didn’t spawn directly above an enemy you’d turn a corner and find them staring back at you. A few points to the author regarding the spawns: Spawns are weighted so that grouped spawns are higher weighted than single spawns, thus if you have a group of 3 spawns and single spawns elsewhere the 3 spawns will see most of the respawns, with the others being spawned at very infrequently. What this means is that the spawns by the bridge entrance will see heavy use while the others will be barely used. This makes the gameplay predictable and confined with little reason to navigate to the other areas of the map. There are also a few spawn points that point into a wall or something along those lines, which can be very annoying for players. The second point is the amount of ‘clutter’ in the map. These random boxes take an already confined play area and shrinking it down even further. This makes the player feel cramped and leads to situations where players will play “ring around the rosy” or get stuck in a hole which seems as though the player would be able to fit through but indeed couldn’t. Remove some of these boxes and use them more efficiently. If you desperately need to add cover use smaller objects that can protect players but still give them space to move. Another point on the map geometry was the number of dead ends. Players don’t like dead ends, at all. It provides players with positions to camp or spots to get stuck when they thought they would be escaping the enemy. It’s never a good idea to have a point on the map where the player has no options. The two that stuck out to me the most were the bridge room and the end of mauler tunnel. I was thinking a teleporter that connected these two points would greatly help the flow of the map and spread things out a bit. Another point that was made that I think would be cool to see is the inclusion of the rocket freezer. It’s a neat little area that would open up another route in the map and spread it out a bit more. The weapon placement was… interesting. The sword location was a bit peculiar and the fact that you had the “walkway that wasn’t” to the sword was also an unusual choice. It would have been far better to allow the player to run under the tube to get to the sword instead of making them think they could make it only to get stuck. The general consensus amongst the testing group was that having a sword and a mauler on such a tiny map was a bit extreme. Possible replace one or the other, or use another one hit weapon like the plasma pistol or the brute shot. This would help spice up gameplay a bit and reduce the emphasis of CQB only. Durability: Well it’s already been addressed how the map is easily broken. Both sides offer a simple jump or grenade jump to get out. These would severly hurt gameplay in oddball had oddball been working. It seems like you’ve already been informed of these breaks but it should be top priority to ensure that there’s no way to exit the map. Also be sure that it works for the gametypes you recommend. Aesthetics: Aesthetics were a large reason why I picked this map to review. It definitely looked interesting in both the pictures and game. I think a big part of this was due to the fact that not many people have attempted a map in this vein on Longshore. It’s not to say that the aesthetics were particularly jaw dropping or that I was blown away, but everything was very well done throughout. It certainly accomplishes the feel of being very tight close quarters map while still being diverse enough so as to allow the player to navigate quickly without being confusing. Originality: Overall Shogun felt very original. Perhaps it’s due to the fact that I haven’t seen many maps on Longshore but it didn’t feel like the same old thing and that helped the play experience greatly. It certainly was a huge challenge to use the middle area of Longshore and I’d say you accomplished this well. There are definitely ways that I would have changed the design to fit a more diverse player base. Though it’s safe to say that there are players out there who enjoy the chaotic close quarter’s style of play, and Shogun delivers. Enjoyment: 4/10 Balance: 3/10 Durability: 2/10 Aesthetics: 7/10 Originality: 8/10 24/50 Overall:
Rough. I played through it (but on a very random gametype, so I'm not sure if it counts) and the smaller side room was never really used in gameplay, but other than that, it was fun. But once again, gametype was insane (300% speed, 50% gravity, random main and secondary weapons, infinite ammo/grenades, you get the picture). Hope to see a v2 with the problems you listed fixed, your map improved upon via the huge review above me, and my post.
Yeah I failed big time. Even though it was harsh to look at, it is helping me fix up some things, so hopefully it will turn out better with the v5. This was my first attempt at a competetive map and I am starting to understand what elements have to go into it for a balanced game, thanks to Mick.
This isn't highschool, a 50% is average. So this map was slightly below average and would have been higher had it not been so breakable. I try to be honest and sincere, usually when doing so it comes off as rough because I say the things that need to be said. When I choose to review a map it's usually something I find interesting that I have high hopes, so it's a compliment to even get a review. By giving a critical review I hope to educate the map creator on flaws they know and flaws they might not even be aware of. I'm glad you're making a new version, I look forward to it.
I've downloaded the map yesterday and gave it an extensive forge-through. The map is obviously very small. You say it's intended for a 3v3 but I'm seeing as that would be too much. With one person from a team stationed in one of the main rooms, there wouldn't be too many places to spawn out of sight. You do have spawns at the end of hallways, but I can see some weaker teams getting trapped there if the other team has some power weapons. That segways me quite nicely into my next point. The overshield and the sword are a bit too close together for my liking. Even though the sword takes a bit of effort to get to, I could easily have them within 5 seconds of each other. Not quite sure of the spawn times, but if they're set on different time intervals it could help balance this out. The map is wonderfully merged and greatly designed. You really squeezed as much space as you could out of the given area you chose. I must point out that the new staircase you pointed out is easily breakable. There's no excuse for this especially consdiering the amount of budget you have left. All these points considered, the map is still a great accomplishment. You should be proud of yourself for making a playable map here. The geometry you've created in the overshield room is exceptionally well made. A nice map you have here, and I'm lokking foward to what you can make in the future. Edit: Ah, you'll have to excuse me. I've just seen your v.5 update after posting this. It'd be advised to add the update to the first page so that people don't make the same mistake that I have.
@Nibs: My main suggestion is to stick to the geometry, and stop worrying about cover. To me at least, it seems like you put down some pretty solid rooms and paths...and then put cover EVERYWHERE, making the game extremely close-quarters. Especially in those long hallways, remove most or even all of that cover, let players for the most part use the geometry as where they go to, not areas to hide behind, that gameplay is for games like Gears of War and Call of Duty. I think you'll find some much more enjoyable fights at longer ranges, cross room battles, and flanking, rather than rushing at each other hoping to get off a good grenade or a backsmack. In general, cover should be one of the last things you add to your map, if you find people unable to stand a chance, sometimes they need something to hide behind and regain shields before continuing forward. A great example of maps that barely use cover are Guardian and The Pit...we did a fairly extensive part on it in the Forging 201 for Map Design Theory - Knowledge, hopefully if you read that and apply it, this map could be significantly better.
I'll give that a try Insane. When I think about it, walking through some of the smaller rooms like the room that leads up to the bridge are overly compact feeling, if that makes any sense at all. I'm going to remove the crates from the bridge room and the hallway just outside of it. Also, once these changes are made this will be v6, how do I change the thread title from Shogun v4, to Shogun v6? @cartoonwolf. The shotgun and OS are pretty close together, but the OS doesn't spawn til 90 seconds into the game. Also with the cover removed, I dont think the shotgun will be as powerful. It will be easier for players to move around.
Honestly, I'd remove nearly all of the cover you have on the whole map. Most of it is just there to be there and doesn't help much. If people are getting trapped too much at the same points when you're looking at the film clip, you'll know where cover or geometry changes needs to happen. and you can VM/PM me or a moderator to change the title.