Debate God

Yeah. I had a similar, albeit reversed, problem in my household. But my parent's were pretty okay about it in the end, because the finally just decided that they weren't very Christian. We weren't even going to church by that time.

Or it might have been my constant arguing caused them to lose faith in me. Dunno which.

 

If you had ran to a Catholic church or a Jewish church, would you really expect a different answer? If I take this story to be true, you decided to become a Christian out of some sort of false sense of being in debt to god. A psychologically traumatised 10 year old is not someone you try to convert! Or maybe it is, I hear Christianity doesn't "bind souls in servitude" like it used to.

It fell on his face just when you needed it to? That's no coincidence.

Yer a wizard, RadiantRain!

 

Glad we have opposite stories... I had an Atheist Family, you had a Christian Family. Only I never made my parents religious.

Probably, but like you said. I was traumatized, afraid, and alone. The first help I received was from a Church. I call it destiny, you call it luck. I don't really care which it is, I've "decided to become a Christian out of some sort of false sense of being in debt to god." Just like you said, only I don't believe it's false.

Also, you're lucky I did not get raped or else I would have found that comment offensive.

 

No. It's too long XD

I believe this graph explains it...



I also believe the x-axis could be replaced with "Depth of Content in Post."

 

Spoiler

I read it, but like everyone else in this thread, we ignore what we can't answer... " You didn't see what was, Rain. You saw what you wanted to see. " I liked that part.

In honesty, you guys do make me doubt religion. The reason I left this debate is because I can't bring up proof that their is no God. I don't know how, but something in my mind tells me.

Don't think though that you will persuade me to become an Atheist just because of what I said. I can't and won't become an Atheist.

The World is a violent place, and I want hope that their is something better then this wretched life here. I want to see my parents, my parent's parents, my children and my grand children. That is why I don't want to be an Atheist, I want my children to have morals. Say what you want, even if you prove to me God does not exist I will never be altered.

This is why I don't like to debate about this topic, why bother when it won't change anything.

Spoiler

The chart it speaks the truth!!!

 

Religion is not the only source of morality in the world and to say that an atheist cannot have morals is insulting at best.

If the numerous recent political scandals involving extramarital affairs are any indication, then clearly Christianity doesn't do a good enough job protecting its revered concept of marriage. Is it not a sin to commit adultery? Is it not immoral?

Morality is defined and taught to future generations by the society as a whole. No one group can lay claim to controlling it or ultimately influencing it. It's a combination of religious beliefs, popular culture, and countless other factors.

haha, but doesn't it? lol

 

I agree with you and respect you for most of this, until you said "I want my children to have morals." I'm an atheist, and i like to think i have morals thank you very much. Some of the most immoral things in history are because of religion, and immoral things are happening everyday because of it. Honestly pushing something like religion onto your kids is immoral if you ask me... That's one major peeve i have about it, kids need to be able to choose for themselves what they want to believe.

You don't need to throw religion at your children for them to have morals, it's not hard to raise them to know what's right and wrong.

 

That would be so much more heart-warming were it not for the condescending "Well, I never made my parents religious."

Imagine if time had reversed it self and you were back on that fateful day, only this time you notice that there is a Catholic church even closer than the Christian one. You go inside and meet the same nice people who insist you were saved by god, who call your parents, e.c.t. Pretty much everything is different except the church. Can you honestly say that, were it this scenario, you'd have become a Christian and not a Catholic?

If the lamp hadn't have hit him you would have been raped, and I would have no reason to draw comparisons between the illogical conclusion that you're a wizard and the illogical conclusion that you were saved by god, so no, you wouldn't have been offended.

 

Imagine if time had reversed it self and you were back on that fateful day, only this time you notice that there is a Catholic church even closer than the Christian one. You go inside and meet the same nice people who insist you were saved by god, who call your parents, e.c.t. Pretty much everything is different except the church. Can you honestly say that, were it this scenario, you'd have become a Christian and not a Catholic?



Sorry there, champ but Catholicism is a part of christianity, Christians in general believe that Jesus was the messiah, ther are three major monotheistic religions, Christianity, Judaism, and Muslim, each with their own sects inside that basically believe the same thing, but differ on the smallest little dumb position like whether or not pastors/preists/preachers can marry
and that's my little factoid schpiel for today

 

That's my point. After an incredibly high-stress situation, people are willing to believe anything is a sign. If an atheist got into a car accident and a Christian was the one who pulled him out of the wreck, it would be a "sign from god". But when I do nice things, being an atheist, it doesn't mean crap. No-one's going to become an athiest because I stopped them from getting mugged. Rather, it's a "sign from god" because he sent someone to save you.

Giving yourself supernatural importance is naive.

 

Why does it have to be a sign from god? Could it not simply be interpreted as good luck combined with the advanced safety systems of today's modern automobiles?

 

I've been reading alot of posts commenting on morality and or morals of said side. I say both sides have morrals and both have great immoralities. Look at humanity today , countless acts of kindness and countless acts of hatred and in-humanity from both religious and non religious people. The one thing that tips me is how someone can be religious and at the same time hate anouther due to differing religions or non beliefs. I personaly have seen more religious killings and acts of violence through out history and in my life time than I have seen been caused by people who do not believe, just look at the middle East and all its religious wars. I think this to be more than a coincedence.
Objecting views are welcome.
My point : religion is possibly one of the greatest causes for violence and that morality and immorality is shown from both sides.

 

Anyone who thinks Atheists don't hold morals is clearly a fool beyond bothering with.

Please, just stop with religion causing violence. Yes, religion may cause lots of violence and crime, but this thread is not about every single religion, and if it were about a religion, its Christianity. Stop addressing the religion at hand (Christianity) like its every other violent religion on the planet. Saying religion causes more deaths than anything else is such a foolish statement. Take a look at Christianity. Do Christians kill more people than people kill Christians? Certainly not. Most violence is caused against the religion than for it, and who's fault is that? Not the religion's.

 

Overall I agree with that statement. Disease is the number one killer of people. But as for deaths caused by people killing each other, religion is definitely a leading cause. Check out this wikipedia page detailing deathtolls from a collection of wars. A vast majority of those wars were either catalyzed by religious conflict or worsened by religious factors.

Crusades. Inquisition.

No. Most violence is caused by people misinterpreting their religion to allow violent conflicts for dominance and power. So while it may not be the actual religion's intent or practices, the people that create these conflicts are almost always acting in the religion's name. Therefore while the brunt of the blame can be laid upon these zealous individuals, the religion is still responsible for the actions its members undertake.

 

The amount of casualties in the Crusades are still open to speculation, but we know that at a maximum the deaths added up to equal nine million. The inquisition killed only thousands. Both of those combined are only a fraction of the deaths caused in WW2.

You don't do something in the religion's name if you misinterpret it. Its like saying that you're following the guidelines a book has told you to do, but you completely twisted the book. Are you still following the original guidelines? No.

People will pervert anything to look like it was done in the harm of religion or any other topic. What about Jack Thompson? He does his best to blame issues on video games because the user causing the issue had a relation to video games, even minorly.

 

I thought we debated this already in this thread? Or was that another thread... idk...

but anyway, the point isn't to say that Religion has caused the most deaths evvaaaa, but that it can be held responsible for the deaths of a good amount of people. And nine million isn't a small number. Nor are the Crusades and Inquisition the only instances of deaths caused by religion.

 

So what if religion causes deaths? Everything causes deaths. The Wii causes deaths. Should we remove it because it causes deaths? Not at all. Misuse of anything can cause death. Should we discontinue computers because you can bash someone's head into one and kill them, causing a death? The simple answer is no. Religion (the one we're talking about) is not meant to cause violence, and neither is a Wiimote.

 

It doesn't even have to be killings I can focus on just the violence which can cause death if serious enough. I didn't mention Christianity I was making a observation of multiple religions[I don't have to know anouther religions beliefs to notice violence] . Also yes religions including Christianity do try to help and do good but more times than not you will see conflic between two [as seen in the middle east/ holy land]. I just see religion causing more trouble than it should.
@ the Wii mote comment Nintendo is supposed to cause death because when Japan invades the US we will all be too tired to fight them after some Wii golf or Wii boxing :] lol.