I've just played around on forge and wow.. The base designs, blue especially, are truly inspiring and constructed magnificently. Every building on this map is unique and whilst I can see influences from halo maps and campaigns, I applaud you on your obvious commitment in making a feature worthy map. Only flaw I noticed occurs when your standing behind either of the bases, on the dunes. The objects flash and change colour rapidly, which looks pretty cool but in gameplay it might prove to be a little distracting.
Nice layout, i know what you mean about sandbox eating objects, i have several maps that have objects that fell into the floor and then i saved it with out realizing. so now i am wasting budget on items that i can never delete. annoying.
great map man, i loved the bases and the towers.Its also easy to drive around.the weapons are nicely balanace. 10/10. And if you need any help for the videos for atals just send me a message gt:Clueless16.
Wow I really like the looks of this map. Both of the bases are very unique and have lots of merging. All of the merges and objects on this map are very well placed. Looks like this map plays well for slayer and CTF. Definite DL from me can't wait to check it out.
Ya know, there's a ton of positives to this map, and a lot things that I like. But I also see some pretty glaring issues. Time for the map's first real criticism (with love) *Note: I only really go into such detail on map's that I feel have a ton of potential, and ones that I really could think could be all-time with some tweaks (this is based off of a forge-through. No games have been played yet. But I do have a ton of experience and the criticism Im going to offer is more along the lines of what I feel to be basic principles to map design that can be pinpointed pre-testing..though I do plan on testing). I appreciate the thought you put into the layout, the lines of sight, and the larger-than forge feel the whole map gives. But I also feel you way overdid it on the aesthetics, and that some budget could be spent in more suitable ways. The middle structure feels pretty awkward. I want to comment on the Rockets/Overshield spawns.. but without tests I don't feel comfortable. Moving on, I don't think one should have to jump to get onto the central structure. I think the combination of all the cubbies/crevices down low, with the low ceilings might be restricting on player flow thoughout that structure. I think the structure should probably have at least 2 ways to get on top of it (on opposing sides) that don't require a jump. This is critical to mainstream maps, and if you are planning on attempting to get this into matchmaking, you should aim to make the map as user friendly as possible. I think the teleporters, while giving that nostalgic Coagulation feel, are poor design choices in their current form. With all the aesthetics used in the other aspects of the map, I'd bet you could easily muster up roughly a $100 (maybe more) to both work on the central structure to improve its flow and intuitiveness, and to improve the receiver node locations. Build some small semi-structures up around those to give them more of a sense of purpose. While I understand their location and the LOS that is, and more importantly isn't available at their locations, they still feel out of place. These structures do not have to be elaborate by any means, and could probably be done with less than 5-6 items each. The vehicle placement behind the grass base doesn't seem very sound.. The semi-circle 15 yds from the base doesn't match the feel of the rest of the map's cohesiveness. The vehicle spawns in the blue base are much more sound. I know you can't exactly just throw the grass base vehicles inside, but Id like to see a more cohesive unit (base+vehicles) overall, if that makes sense. Hug the mongeese to the walls more. Perhaps group them together on the same side and do the same with the Hog and Ghost on the other. You could play around with it, there's a few different ways to go about it. Also, mongeese on 90s but the Ghost on 30s? Bear in mind the mongeese on Valhalla are on 10s respawn timers. Yours could very easily drop down to 30s, if not lower. Mongeese don't tend to get blown up as much as other vehicles do. Somethin to think about. That's pretty quick for a Ghost respawn as well, usually, but I can't really comment on how that particular aspect will affect gameplay without tests. I do LOVE the Blue base's layout though. Very, very nice. Large, intuitive, pretty. However, the 2 side structures with the carbines on them require a crouch jump to get on top of. I already addressed this a bit earlier. Needs a ramp like the side structures for grass base. Overall, I think the map has a TON of potential, but I think you may have missed the mark on some parts as well. You have a good idea of what you're doing in forge, obviously, but I fear all the overdone aesthetics are ultimately holding the map back. Well, not the aesthetics themselves, but the lack of money due to the aesthetics. I'd really LOVE to see some changes made before you submit to ATLAS. I think you'd see far better results, and could end up with one of the top Sandbox maps so far. Cheers, sir.
I appreciate your points and I understand your concerns, but there is a method to my madness as I've somewhat covered in the pic descriptions. 1 - The small areas under the middle structure are only about as long as a warthog. So while it is small, it allows the bottom to breathe a bit more than long wall spaces that ultimately could get you killed. These areas have proved extremely useful in games of KOTH. As far as getting to the top goes the structure has 4, 2 each side. I really didn't have much choice to make the "feet" jumpable. Geomerging would have made it too low, using the small corners underneath made them stick out too far and affected vehicle use, and interlocking wedges just ended up adding a gap at each corner that players could get stuck on. So I went with the hop because it's it's an immediately recognizable action to take when you come up to it. The Rockets/OS spans are very open and can be covered with good BRs and sniping. 2 - I think you're only the second person to have issues with the teleporters. Leaving the reciever nodes in the open was pretty neccessary. There needed to be a risk/reward for having the teleporters not only being 1/3 the distance accross the map but also being so close to both the Splazer and the Missile Pod. And with blue base's teleporter completely covered and the grass base's having limited LOS I didn't feel it would balance them out by making them safe on both ends. Also during testing, people getting sniped at the reciever nodes didn't happen too often. If need be I could upload some sessions to FS if you want a looksee. 3 - I will admit I did screw up the vehicles a bit. I laeft them all at their default times, either what was originaly on Sandbox, or manualy placed there. Their positions were just so they couldn't all be easily destroyed, as well as not allowing too many opportunities for someone to be able to jump on top of a vehicle then up to the top of the base. While I understand your view on eliminating some aesthetics to free up space for other things, almost every aesthetic piece has a function. The exception is the "Relic" spire, but that was made out of remaining pieces of the original Sandbox map that I wanted to use rather than delete them. All in all believe me when I say that most of your concerns were mulled over while the map was still being built and as testing has showed, doesn't really affect gameplay that much. I do appreciate you pointing out the vehivle issue cuz I completely missed that. Hopefully you can get some decent games on this and come back with a full gameplay review. Thanks again for your time and attention.
This is the most amazing map i've ever seen. Brilliant aesthetics and the merging and interlocking is smooth~ You have given me so many ideas, and I can't wait to play some 5v5 on this. Amzazing, absolutely amazing.
My point about the teleporters had nothing to do with safety or risk v reward, just that they felt out of place and didn't match the feel of the rest of the map. I completely get their location and the RvR factor, and I understand and appreciate that. Its just the fact that its just a lone, random receiver node in the sand that makes it "out of place." Place it on a merged block and toss a wall slit behind it.. i dunno something to make it seem like an actual part of the map. You don't have to compromise the risk v reward or LOS to make it fit in with the rest of the map. About the central structure, you may have to play with its design a bit in order to achieve some ramps. It might not be as easy as just adjusting the one you have with a piece or two, but the no-jump factor is a pretty elemental part of solid map design. You can take that or leave it, but its pretty hard to argue that a couple ramps wouldn't make the structure more user friendly and MM compatible. Its something you should take a hard look at if your ultimate goal is to get this into MM. If thats not the case, then you don't have to really worry about it. Ill get some games on it later today and get back to ya. Excited about it
The detail in this map is beyond compliment. This definetly screams feature. But what do I know. Anyhow, you have my download and my compliments keep up the good work!!
I agree that they do look odd, but in order to get them to blend in would require more resources just to make it aesthetically sound. I had to make a sacrifice somewhere and the running theme in Forging is gameplay over style, so in that regard I left them as is. While I'm not in a rush to get this off to Altas (it was an idea given to me by about a dozen people) I do understand why it makes sense to ramp up the corners. All I can do is go by my experiences in playtesting and for me personaly it didn't detract from that area of the map. The center piece was the first part of the map I built and in looking at Bungie's own SB default layout they didn't alter their corners at all to make them streamlined. I felt if Bungie doesn't have an issue with it than I shouldn't be too concerned. Besides it would have taken 16 wedges to fill that transition in and I just felt those resources were better suited elsewhere.
the central structures on your map and defualt sandbox orent comparable. You have active paths and playspaces where people are going to regularly traverse up there, whereas default Sandbox just has the double jump to the OV. Ill forge up a variation or two of your structure to give you an idea of what I mean
I was talking about the corner pieces on the bottom as opposed to Bungie's use of them on the sides of the map (I think a Brute Shot spawns there, but I don't play default SB).
Seems to be you are either about $500 over on budget, or there is some odd budget glitch going on. When deleting items, I dont come into money until Ive deleted $500 worth. Which makes making changes pretty difficult. So you may be stuck with what you've got for the most part, not that you seem to mind, apparently. Thats a shame. But being over the budget means it won't be acceptable at ATLAS or in MM. Also a shame. You have a really good map here either way. It could be better with adjustments, but its solid regardless. Note: You have some items not spawning at start. The stone bridge leading up to the side structure to the left of the grass base if youre facing it (spawns at 30s), and the 2 wedge smalls surrounding the lift in blue base (spawn at 180s). I really would have loved to see this thing improved to be the best it could be, and am pretty sadface now. Ah well, still lookin forward to games on it in a bit. Cheers
Hehehe... I did a quick forge-through on Frailty with Zanitor. And damn was I impressed. At first I thought this was a remake of a campaign map.. I don't remember which campaign map... But the blue base definately looked like it. I swear, has anybody got a single match on Frailty yet? I tried to start a group, but nobody showed up. I really want to play a match on this to see how it would play out.. Because as of now, I only see it as one helluva aesthetic map. I can see where gameplay would have its flaws, but I also see where it exceeds. Frailty is definately one of the better maps on Sandbox's ground floor. But how on Earth did you go $500 over the budget!? I thought the budget glitch maps wouldn't effect Sandbox because of the fact that you hit the OLN before the budget most of the time... Is this budget glitched or not? I would really love to see it in MM...
If you can get a party to play this map with, do it. Trust me if this was in matchmaking it could be compared to Utah Mambo. I like this better, personally, and gameplay is amazing for one-sided objectives.
Thats gonna be the firts big feature map in the histories ! Each base have Their Aventage . The midle of the map are very ashestic and the overshield spawn are very good ! 5/5
This map looks absolutely amazing. I have downloaded and run through it and could find no real problems. My favourite part of the map is probably the lift tube into the blue base.
ABSOLUTELY NO DOUBT BEST SANBOX MAP YET. seriously i just feel embarassed about my maps knowing stuff like this is possible...