"The Bible itself doesn't say you'll go to Hell if you don't repent". You believe the bible. Hence you must believe there is no hell.
Facepalm Stop facepalming everyone on the debate forum. ScarecrowXavier asked you a pretty straight forward question. If he can't understand what your position on hell is, I don't think that's on him. It's a little hard to follow. Here's what I am hearing your position as: They never mention hell in the bible.....so it's not a threat or a fear tactic......but there really is a hell.....and you will go there if you don't accept Jesus. Please correct us.
..and I want a gorram answer. Highlight's reel: The way I see it your shirking away from your Christian fear mongering.
This debate should've ended a while back when someone said.. "If god is truly all powerful than god should be able to create a Mass that even God itself cannot lift.. and if it can, then that would also mean that god is not All powerful. and if it can't then that would mean god is not All powerful" Like i said in earlier posts i think mary just committed adultery which was a HUGE illegal act back then, so she came up with the story of jesus when she found she was pregnant.. to cover it up. and of course the religious fanatic's swarmed the story and blew it up.. thus creating the bible.. which is the entire BASE or FOUNDATION of the modern christian religion.. before the bible christianity was just a means for higher up's to scare the masses so they wouldn't do what they didn't want the masses to do.. My post might not be pretty or good grammar wise, but i'm tired and don't feel like going all 'poetic' in a debate that should've ended PAGES back.. /end debate ?
Explain how 40 different people wrote a book of old times and it mysteriosly formed together to form the Bible, with 4 different points of views of one occurance: Jesus Christ on earth...im a Christian yes
I'm face palming because you STILL fail to understand anything I say. Why do I even bother debating if you seem to ignore what I say, then argue that I didn't say it? I said this on the last page: Point being: Hell and Heaven were always there. (Get it now?) Just because the Bible doesn't say you don't go to hell in the same sentence that says "repent and go to heaven" doesn't mean there is no hell. To be honest, I have no idea how you argue science and evolution if you can't understand that super simple logic. And Makisupa/Scarecrow, your quoting of my multiple points is useless. The way I see it you have nothing better to do than sift through my posts for something that has no regard to the argument. If I had enough time I would definitely search every time you guys have failed to understand anything I say, not being my fault.
Because religious nutjobs took things to the extremes.. you must remember most of the people who wrote the books in the bible weren't high class.. and like i said above, the high class people made up Christianity to use it as a means of scaring the weaker lower class into doing they're will that they would otherwise not do. the bible started off with mary saving her ass from admitting she committed the high crime of adultery and got knocked up, so she made the story up that it was gods child.. the religious nuts then swarmed in the kid became popular while in the womb.. he was probably followed or watched by these people his entire life which is why the story never faded.. he soon began to get followers who wrote the books.. the kid, 'Jesus' growing up in all this religious popularity more than likely studied and learned christianity in and out, saw that it was bad and tried to change it and ended up beleiving that he himself really was the son of said 'god' when in fact it was all just a story started by his mom to hide her dirty little secret.. if you grow up hearing that your somthing you'll more than likely believe it. He and his followers wrote the bible, then they realized the story didnt have a true beginning.. so i'm assuming with this young man's (Jesus..) imagination running wild in all this religious popularity that was forced upon him since birth probably had a dream of what he was certain was the beginning then he told his followers and they added it into the begginning of the bible.. Makes sense to me.. Then wouldnt that mean that he is not All Powerful?
Ctrl V While I do appreciate what you bring to the god/religion debates on this forum, I am going to have a hard time reading your posts now. The entire bolded section above is copied word for word from this website. There is nothing wrong with searching for information on a topic you want to debate about, but you should still be doing the debating using your thoughts and your words. We don't want to debate with the author of the article on that web page. We want to debate with you. I'm sure that you can come up with reasonable arguments on your own without resorting to Ctrl V.
Way to evade what we were ACTUALLY TALKING ABOUT. Which is that hell is used to scare children and shaky faithed Religionists into believing. You'd have be an absolute idiot to not pick up from the bible that IF YOU DO NOT REPENT then YOU WILL GO TO HELL. I don't give a crap whether it is stated, it's most certainly implied. To be honest, I can understand why you argue God and Creationism, seeing as you can't understand that super simple logic.
You never cease to give me a good laugh. I already told you how its not a fear tactic: Its not a fear tactic. The Bible itself doesn't say you'll go to Hell if you don't repent, its just the other side of the story that only the church mentions. Then you said, "So hell doesn't exist?" Whereas I already said: "Hell and Heaven were always there." So, care to explain why you still bother to continue this argument that has already been answered? Oh, and just so you know, we weren't even talking about scare tactics. You, the one who didn't even read my posts fully (If you hadn't you might want to reread them) said "So there's no hell?" If it wasn't dumb enough asking that you bothered to continue.. now are you actually going to get on topic instead of continuing your bantering and start to show what hell has to do with God's existence? I'll say it again, just for you. In caps, too, so you notice. IF THE BIBLE DOESN'T SAY "TURN OR BURN' THE BIBLE ITSELF IS NOT FEAR MONGERING. THE BIBLE NEVER FEAR MONGERS. THE BIBLE CONDEMNS FEAR MONGERING. Hm, I wonder, even the Bible says "You can choose life or death" want to know what it says next? I hope you're still reading this. It says "CHOOSE LIFE!" Whoa!!! Fear mongering right?! Look, I've tried to be calm with you, but you're just totally getting off track here, and you're talking about random crap which pertains nothing to what you originally said. You're the one straying off topic - the last post you made that was actually debatable was about hell not existing, and all of a sudden we're talking about fear mongering? What happened exactly?
I don't understand why you're talking about who made the Bible... ... ... But you don't get the idea. Julius Caesar could have been faked... Just get one incredibly communist leader to go ape crazy... and bang he's got everyone rewriting books, pictures, documents. Go read 1984 by George Orwell.. That will explain everything. What about Abraham? Moses? (just to name a few) EDIT: and about the fear thing... Yeah hell is supposed to be feared. God is supposed to be feared. He's sort of the master and overlooker. It's simple, if you don't go to heaven, you go to hell. Some people say there's something in between the two... I just don't happen to believe that.
Hell as a device to produce faith through fear wasn't brought up by me, you denied it, I found a hole in that logic. Get it now sport?
Oh please. http://www.forgehub.com/forum/882851-post1687.html You were trying to tell me there was no hell when I clearly said there was. Then after Makisupa multi quoted me it seemed as if you jumped on the train and multi quoting past times I've said things that don't pertain to this particular discussion.
Well, since you said humanity breeds ignorance, then who is to say that the bible is immune from our faults? We made the bible, so it is only as good as we are. And your idea is what happened with the church. Leaders were afraid of change, so they promoted their ideas whilst putting down scientists such as Galileo. The thing with your example is that one crazy leader doesn't control the whole world; the other nations not under his control still have the right history documents and such. However with the church, they control all of what Christianity is, so if leaders there decide to change things, it affects all Christians.
Humanity pretty much copied all of Jesus' teachings.. Humanity didn't just make it all up... And so what Christian leaders are you talking about? The pope? Believe me when I say that the pope doesn't have enough influence to change something in the bible. People won't just say yea you're right Jesus was actually shot with an ak47.. You're very wrong. Sure it came to a level of corrupion during the Reformation, but a true Christian will always be there to stop evil. This case being Martin Luther..... Whereas humanity in general is much more unstable. Look at communist China. If you google Tiananmen Square in central China you won't find the people being mowed over by tanks or monks setting themselves on fire as a form of rebelion. You'll find pro-government pictures and things saying how the government saved the country from evil college students and protesters. Humanity is simply lost without God. And that, my friend, is a fact.
So what about other religions? No, not the pope. Other religious leaders such as those in the Reformation period you mentioned. What is a true Christian? Are you 100% sure that every other Christian will agree with what you think is a true Christian? I'll finish later
I'm a Christian. Lutheran to be exact. Now, I am generally a pessimistic and realistic person. I tend to think things through, sometimes too much. But for some reason I strongly believe in God. It puzzles me because the only *proof* of God is the Bible, which has been altered and changed throughout history. Yet, I still go to church every week. If I didn't go with my family every week, I really don't know how strong my faith would be. When I'm at church or a church function my mind isn't there. I think of all of the things I could be doing. It just feels like I'm wasting my time. The thought of investing all my time into my faith, and it all ends up to be wasted is just sickening. But, at the same time, this makes my belief in God even stronger. This world is a pretty depressing place. Chock full of disease (Swine Flu!), poverty, corruption, greed, genocide, homicide, ignorance, and just general laziness. If I didn't have something all-powerful to believe in I really don't think it would be worth living. You might be more optimistic than I, but any way you look at it, our lives on Earth are pretty insignificant. The idea of living forever in heaven is looking pretty good. My faith in God is really what keeps me going. Real or not, God and the Bible provide me with a drive to be the best that I can be and to help other people lead enjoyable and fullfilling lives. If it turns out that God isn't real then someone managed to pull the wool over millions of peoples eyes. And as long as I am happy and love to live, then I think I would be ok with that. Now that I'm reading over my post it doesn't make much sense, but whatever.
The truth is that life is short. What I have done, and what I wish everyone else could do also, is to realize that our time should be spent happy, not mourning for things we can't change. You just need to accept that bad things happen, but remember that if you dwell on them you will be forever unhappy. Instead, just move on and focus on the good parts of every day and doing what you enjoy.