Oh no, there's not a scrap of proof on that entire page. My point was that there are hundreds of religions, all without a single bit of proof. Christianity, even if there IS a god, is still incredibly unlikely to be the one true religion. The Christian god isn't backed up at all. No religion is. The only proof that any religion has is (1) the holy book, which proves nothing, since it can easily be written by a single imaginative person, and (2) miracles, which we have already proved are statistically irrelevant. You are also making a leap of faith to assume that every religion other than Christianity was made up on the spot and is subjective. Yes, Christianity wasn't made up on the spot- it took many years for people to make it up. By the way, Christianity is subjective also. The limited morals present in Christianity were created by people. One could easily say that the morals in Islam are objective, as long as they believe that an Islamic god exists.
I know what they mean. What you said though sounded like you meant Christianity itself was objective, and all other religions were subjective. I didn't know you were referring to the morals given by each religion... I think. Correct me, because as you can tell, I'm not reading things well today. EDIT: Yeah, what Zergling said.
It would only make sense. Honestly, how many denominations of Christianity are there? Denominations are just asking to be disproved and falsified. Now tell me this. Is it just chance Christianity has around longer than any other religion? Obviously people have seen miracles and proof enough to still believe in God, let alone if they were born into a Christian family. I won't bother saying a single word to you until you even bother opening your Bible and telling me where there is no proof. Prophecies in the Bible have already come true, except for revelation. You mean to tell me this is bogus? I don't know how many times I've repeated myself in this thread, for any reason, but THE HOLY BIBLE IS NOT A SCIENCE BOOK. Once you get that through your thick skulls you'll realize that even attempting to disprove the Bible doesn't mean anything. God inspired and told the people what to write. Have you ever read a good book? Then be inspired to write one of your own? That's what it is, except the guy who knows everything about books told the author what to write. Obviously Christianity wasn't made up on the spot, neither was it in many years, because the whole Bible wasn't finished until something like the later half of the first century AD. Unless you're referring to the sanhedrin, but that still relates to God.
A few months ago, I wrote a paper on the Meme Theory. Basically, it is the idea that you can apply a form of natural selection to ideas. Religion, and especially Christianity, are the only ideas that manage to work in all seven transmission situations. (#6, Cognitive, only because it seems true, no because it is). The problem with your argument is that you are making the assumption that god exists in the first place. What if the bible is just a collection of stories, and the claims of it's divinity are false? In that situation, it proves nothing at all. Also, show me a prophesy that has come true and I will happily refute it.
So, in that case, we should listen to every single holy book? The difference between trusting a claim of having sheep and trusting a holy book is a large one. When somebody walks up to you and says "I have a dollar bill in my pocked" you probably believe them. Why not? Having a dollar bill isn't unusual at all, and what reason would they have to lie? If somebody walks up to you and says "I have been inspired by god to tell you the story of creation." You are much more skeptical, because the chances of this happening are none. What I'm trying to say is 'extraordinary claims need extraordinary evidence.' Read my previous post on the Meme Theory (I edited that post after you posted your above post).
Are you questioning God and then saying my argument is false because that's what I'm defending? If you are, that's foolish. The Bible is a collection of stories, that believes in God. The Bible would not be the Bible if it didn't believe in God. Have you ever read the Bible? Not to make assumptions, but its safe to say lots of people haven't and yet still accuse it. I've done a fair share of research on evolution and the big bang, so I don't look like a complete idiot when I debate. 1. The Jewish people would be scattered worldwide; yet Israel would become a nation again-ref Isa 66:8; Mic 5:3. Prophecy fulfilled. This happened exactly as predicted on May 14, 1948. That’s 1 out of 1. Note: Israel was destroyed in approximately 721 B.C. and Judah about 135 years later. For the last 2500 years, approximately fourteen different peoples have possessed the land of Israel. Nevertheless, the Bible showed that the day would come when the nation of Israel would be reborn. The rebirth of Israel was a key sign, indicating we had entered a time period called the latter days. It was the beginning of a countdown leading to the Tribulation and culminating with the Battle of Armageddon and the return of Jesus immediately after. Along with the fulfillment of this crucial event are over 360 prophecies that would all come together, so we might recognize that the Tribulation is very close at hand. Twenty nine of them are listed here. Yet the Bible foretells that most people would not believe these things, despite the overwhelming evidence of the fulfillment of the signs from God’s Word and the incredible rebirth of Israel happening exactly as predicted. As people refused to believe the flood was coming in Noah’s time, so people today willingly choose to disregard the signs of the times. 2. Israel shall be brought forth in one day, at once-ref Isa 66:8. Prophecy fulfilled-May 14, 1948. That’s 2 out of 2. Note: On Nov. 29, 1947, the General Assembly of the U.N. approved a resolution calling for the establishment of a Jewish state in Palestine. On the morning of May 14, 1948 (the last day of the British mandate), a meeting of the People’s Council took place in Israel to decide on the name of the state and to finalize the declaration. At exactly 4pm, the proclamation ceremony began at the Tel Aviv museum. The 979 Hebrew words of the Scroll of Independence were read. All stood, and the scroll was adopted. The notorious White Paper, issued by the British in 1930 restricting Jewish immigration, was declared null and void. Members of the People’s Council signed the proclamation. David Ben-Gurion rapped his gavel, declaring, “The State of Israel is established. This meeting is ended.” Israel was brought forth as a nation in one day, at once. It happened exactly as predicted. At midnight, the British soldiers and high commissioner would leave. President Truman was swift in announcing U.S. recognition of Israel. The following morning, on May 15, Israel was under armed attack by the Egyptians, Syrians, Lebanese, Jordanians, and Iraqis. 3. The rebirth of Israel would happen after many days. It would occur a long time in the future after the prophecy was made and at the time the bible calls the latter days-Ezek 38:8. Prophecy fulfilled-May 14, 1948. That’s 3 out of 3. Note: It is estimated that this prophecy was made around 580 B.C. Approximately 2500 years later, in 1948, this prophecy was fulfilled. 4. Israel would be brought forth (or reborn) “out of the nations.”-Ezek 38:8. Prophecy fulfilled-May 14, 1948. That’s 4 out of 4. Note: As previously stated, on Nov. 29, 1947, the General Assembly of the “United Nations” approved a resolution calling for the establishment of a Jewish state in Palestine. This prophecy was perfectly fulfilled. Consider, for centuries the land of Israel had been occupied by many nations. Israel was “brought forth out of the nations”—the children of Israel from many nations were returning to their ancient homeland. 5. Israel must regain the city of Jerusalem-Joel 2:32; Isa 28:14; Ezek 22:19. This happened just as predicted in 1967. That’s 5 out of 5. Note: The Bible gives us two methods so we would know we are in the last generation. One is by Israel’s rebirth. The other, by a precise line of events that would all come together at one time. Israel was reborn on May 14th, 1948. The Bible indicates that from Israel’s rebirth a generation would not pass till all be fulfilled. A Jewish generation is figured from the age of 20 to 60 (1968). We are not setting any date, but it seems clear that we are living in that generation now. 6. The Christian church at the time of the end would be lukewarm, neither cold nor hot for Jesus. Prophecy fulfilled. That’s 6 out of 6. Note: God will spew them out. Many church leaders and people that call themselves a Christian and are sure they are saved will not be going to heaven. The Bible tells us—you have acquired wealth, but your true condition is wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked and you don’t know it-Rev 3:14-22. This is today’s church. Most churches preach very little Scripture, but lots of worldly stories. Many sing a great deal, but put very little emphasis on repentance, obeying, serving, and fearing God, the fruits of the Spirit, Bible prophecy, water baptism by immersion, and studying your Bible faithfully every day. Many are only entertainment centers that teach what their members want to hear. People will not endure sound doctrine-2 Tim 4:3. They turn away from the truth-2 Tim 4:4. Many church members are so lukewarm or dead, they don’t even bring their Bibles with them to the house of God. Many ministers think this is the best church age ever, yet the Bible clearly shows it is the worst and most deceived.
We are in the end times. Ever since Jesus told us he would return we were in the end times. The church however has always since been lukewarm, or somewhat worse, according to the Pauline letters.
That's not necessarily true. The Koran is accepted as a religious text, and yet you (being a Christian, I believe you said) probably assume it was written by just an imaginative person. Or the prophecies of Ellen G. White, or the teachings of L. Ron Hubbard. All of these things are taught to people as truth, but that doesn't make them so. Um... it hasn't? Judaism and Zoroarstrianism have been around longer than Christianity and are still practiced today.
Judaism - old testament. The basically older version of Christianity. Before Jesus came there was Judaism. Don't bother saying Torah - It is the same thing as the first 5 books of the old testament, which was made for the Israelites back then, so there's no reason to still follow it. The Bible itself states that the old covenant has passed, and the new covenant is to come. Zoroarstrianism was developed in 600 bc, much after Judaism.
That doesn't mean anything. I wasn't trying to prove that there wasn't any. However, if they ever did listen to God in the first place (remember, there is such thing as fakers) then they would know it is time to move onto the new testament.
aMeoba, I'll get to your prophesies eventually. I want to have a little more time to think about it, because you have so far not listened to any arguments related to probability and chance, so I would like to do more than that. Anyways, on to other stuff: Of course not. Your logic is circular. You say that because God exists, the bible must have been inspired by him, and because the bible exists God must exist also. No, we shouldn't worship lolcats- they never tried to make you worship them... No matter how much that person thinks they are right, it doesn't mean they are. No matter how trustworthy they may seem, without evidence they have nothing. Can't you see that everything you have been saying is from a biased point of view?? Jews believe the new testament is false, just as you believe the Koran is false.
Um, that's really a matter of opinion. You can't say, "Psh, those Jews. They never moved on." They believe what they believe and you believe what you believe. You're trying to connect Judaism to Christianity to protect the point you made earlier. I'm not going to lie; what you tried to just do is silly. It's like trying to say you've been around for a long time because your dad is old.
No, I say that because the Bible proves God because God inspired people to write the Bible. Too hard to comprehend? If God never told anybody to write the Bible, or never told anyone about Him, or never said anything in the first place, no one would believe. The fact that He did is why we do. And neither did God. They are still right in their own heart, according to Diablo's statement. Again, i'll do some re instating. Don't try disproving the Bible, I can tell most of you have never read more than a book of it. @Eons: Is it really opinion that God said it is time to move on from the Old Covenant? The fact that IT IS DONE, meaning it should NO LONGER BE FOLLOWED. Like I had said, if the Jews really did listen to God in the first place, and weren't hypocritical, they would have noticed when God said that the New Covenant is what is now taking place, the fact that the old is done. @Zergling: How is it biased? I also never stated the koran as false. The koran is much like the torah, except with a few different views. The koran believes Jesus was merely a prophet, and that allah was the ultimate God. Like I said earlier about perverted Christian views, that is how the koran came to be. Let me put it this way. They're not a Jew if they never obeyed God in the first place, and if they did, they would have listened and moved on. That's just being hypocritical, and calling me biased for the stating the truth you've never delved into is ignorant.
So, because a few prophesies in the Bible came true, and it featured a guy who did cool things that were inexplicable at the time, God must exist. Let's say someone wrote a book. The book included three correct predictions of certain events. It also included David Blaine. Clearly, since there are prophesied events and a magic guy in the book, everything must be true, and the writer was inspired by God. It just doesn't work.
Here are your statements 1)God inspired people to write the bible 2)Because the bible was inspired by God, God must exist 3)Now, since God exists, he must have been here to inspire the bible 4)Now because we know he inspired the bible, he must exist 5)Now, since he exists, he must have inspired the bible to make people believe 6)Since he inspired the bible, he must exist Get it? On to your otherstatement: There is one reality, which we all perceive differently. Just because he believes he is right doesn't mean that he is actually right, nor does it mean that you must believe him, too. Since the bible was taken from many other sources, we can also assume that the Bible is a perversion of earlier pagan views. Or, if you would rather, we can also say that the new testament is a perversion of the old testament. It could completely wrong, and the old testament could be the only correct holy book, for all you know.
(•_• ) ( •_•) Yes it's opinion. The Jews don't think God said it's time to move on, do they now. What you're saying now has no factual basis; it's all opinion. And you don't know if Zergling has read the bible or "delved into the..." wait, truth? That, my friend, is just another opinion.
He was asking for a completed prophecy. So I googled and quickly found a few. Also, the fact that somebody writes a magical book and makes 3 simply prophecies doesn't work that way either. Actually, its quite easy to tell that somebody's a foney, and that doesn't disprove the Bible, the Bible was inspired by God. Uh.. no. 1: Yes. 2: If you're inspired by someone to write a book, of course that someone exists. You can't be inspired by nothing. Simple logic, really. 3: Obviously if he exists he exists. Your point? 4: Like to repeat stuff don't you? 5: Didn't say this either. Don't pull random facts out of your ass, please, and I mean it when I say that. I've said before God doesn't force people to believe. He gave all the people who wrote the Bible a chance to follow him. Did Jesus forcefully grab Matthew, Peter, and the other fishers? 6: Another repeated statement. Then you must take into question subjective or objective intelligence. Intelligence is not governed by the man who uses it, but by the intelligence itself. @Eons: What they think is totally irrelevant. I can think pigs rain from the sky, do they? By the way, it wasn't my opinion that zergling hasn't read an entire book of the Bible, it was just apparent by some of the things he said. Like evolution, building theories upon logical evidence, correct?
In case you didn't realize, points 3-6 were exact repeats of 1 and 2. I was showing that your logic was going in circles. Lets start that train of thought again, but this time assume that god does not exist. 1: God does not exist. 2: Somebody wrote the bible, but it doesn't prove anything Done. Rinse an repeat. Or, we can do this. 1: God exists 2: Somebody wrote the bible, but it could just be made up, who knows? 3: Logically, since we are without any proof, we must assume that god does not exist
Using that line of thought, I can totally disregard what anyone says, because they're not me. You can't push other's beliefs aside like that. And the line about the "opinion" was referring to when you said the bible was truth.