I went in and looked it over, I did. It was fun to play on, sure, but the aesthetics just didn't work for me. If you like it, that's fine. But I just didn't. That's my opinion, and you're free to have your own.
Alright, I think my lengthy review is far past due, I am sorry I didn't get to it sooner, but I have been busy with stuff of my own. However, now it is here for your reading pleasure! Introduction Not to boast, but I have seen this map since the VERY earliest start, and let me say it has come a long, long ways. It started off with only the attacker's side, and a floating thing in the middle, both of which you completely redid and/or took out. Then you showed me the start of the defenders side, creating a hill with bridges, and angling B-Signs so only their arrows showed pointing up. That still inspires me. You talked of what you wanted, and you didn't even create anything close. This map slowly took form, or reformed before my eyes, and I am glad I got to witness. Now... where to start... Forging Technique/Style Now, you might be thinking, odd category? Indeed, it is. However, what I am about to say would not fit properly anywhere else, and leads smoothly into aesthetics. This has increasingly been a lost concept, few recognize. When an author makes a map, there should be a certain flow, and feeling, something that stands out saying "Hey, this is such and such's map." This style is slowly developed, and cannot exist until the author masters the principles of Forge. You sir, have a fine display of your knowledge and experience with geo-merging, interlocking, and other Forge Techniques. This leads to a style you are beginning to form, which is both brilliant, while also can lead to your downfall. I will get into why later, but it is your technique and style are what truly show in this map, and make it. Aesthetics I look at aesthetics in having 3 parts. First, the overall cleanness of the map, in interlocking and geomerging. Second, the nice little touches to give your map a more professional feel. And lastly, the presentation of the map. Needs moar Interlockingz - Most of your interlocking and geomerging are great, but some of the geomerging is a bit off. I suggest using the door method, and when you grab the object, save and quit. As long as there is no one in your party, it will come out perfect every time. Those little things - You don't have many little, noticeable aesthetic things, but you do have some. While the soccer ball serves no game play value, it is fun to look at and mess up. The use of the arrows on the A and B signs is also quite ingenious. And then, of course your use of man cannons. Do the ingredients make it digestible? - Hmm, I think I am trying to hard to be abstract with my titles. None the less, how does this map fair when compared to a Bungie map? By this I mean, does this map feel like a map? Not just boxes laid out as a place to fight, but actually look and feel like you are having a war in an actual location. Sadly, no. Here is where I elaborate on your style. Your style, your technique, it shows that you are a great improvisational forger, who knows how to make unique, and interesting structures with what material he has. Now does the flaw become easier to see? Your maps do not have a proper layout flow that they would if you pre-plan before you construct. While your structures remain unique and cool, they have limited connection to one another, making this map feel like a layed out set of obstacles, not an actual map. However, this is not all bad, for you do show that you can definitely make great looking structures. In the future, previsualize the map, allowing your unique buildings and geometry to flow together, because if you can pull that off, you might just get a feature. Layout (From a game play perspective) Well, I managed to squish aesthetics with layout a bit unintentionally, but no matter. I covered looks, lets look at nameplate. Here I have little to say. The lack of organization, results in a lightheaded, feel, resulting in fun rather than competitive game play, which is good or bad, depending whether or not you were trying to make a serious competitive map. Game play, In Depth No, there isn't much to say here neither, for like I said, Technique/Style, and as well as Aesthetics are this maps strong points, but game play should not be ignored. Fun or Competitive? Your earlier version of this map, with a fuel rod, and sniper was indeed fun, for defenders that is. However, this new balanced weapon layout, with vehicles change, while not necessarily as fun, is far more balanced, resulting in a competitive edge to casual game play. Even though a mongoose isn't as useful, it is still fun to drive around. The shotgun was in the map before, but you took out the additional fuel rod, which was primarily there to counteract the warthog. All in all, the weapons are now better fitting for the map. The game play is again, fun, with that edge of the seat competitive feel, though not heavily. I had a great time playing on this map, while victory or defeat did not matter in my eye, because I was too busy laughing about kills, or laughing after I got killed. Final Words? By now you might have realized that I have not rated this map. Well, to be honest, it is hard for me to rate maps, both now and in previous reviews, so I think I will now refrain. Why? Because numbers can be intrepretted differently. While some consider a 7/10 a good grade, I think it is horrible, as if the map is brinking terrible. Perhaps I am too lighthearted. But, if you read words alone, as a review, a collection of opinions for the sake of saying what needs to be said, not to back up your rating, I feel as if you better understand what I thought of this map. So with that I leave you with this. Good map. Best I have seen you do? No, getting there? Yes. Previsualize, and have more organization with your structures, and you will give us all a seriously amazing map.
That's OK that you don't like this map much, you have your own opinion. I thought that you hadn't even played on it, but I see know that you have... It would also help him improve the map if you gave some more detailed feedback. What didn't you like about the aesthetics specifically?
Well, to be specific, it simply looked like it was not as well planned as many other maps I have seen, like it had been improvised (and apparently, xX5w33ny70ddXx agrees, although I could be mistaken as to the intent of what he said). In my mind, a good map should be memorable in that whether it is symmetrical or asymmetrical, there should be recognizeable "landmarks" that are easily identifiable and contribute to a common "flow" between each landmark. This makes it easier on the eyes, easier to navigate, and much more enjoyable to play on. And while the map is otherwise fun to play, the lack of that flow just broke it for me.
Firstly I would like to thank you for thanking me. Now onto the map; Facade has some unique structures and some unique game play, when I first played Facade I ran around as if I was playing any other map. I found myself dying at each corner because I was unaware of where I should be going. Once I found the strong points and knew the map back to front I found myself starting to kill people when they were unaware. Facade has a lot of Carney Holes, like the one behind the Dumpster, I remember we were playing 2v3 and I was on you team, you were hiding behind the dumpster and you left me out to get taken 3 on 1. I believe we still won. Most of the structures are unique and play reasonably well, my favorite one is the defenders wall, you packed so much into such a little space. The pallets blocking off a entrance was a great feature, mainly because you would know if a attacker had tried to sneak in. The little tunnel underneath the man cannons also added so much fun to the game play. Game play was very different to most of the maps that I have played, there were so many different looking structures that haven't really been forged before and that made the game play... well play differently(it still was good). Slayer: Definitely the best game type for Facade, there wasn't really any strong points to dominate the other team. There were a perfect amount of BRs to make a perfect pace on the game play. Territories: This was my second favorite game type, it took me awhile to find where I had to stand to capture the territory on the soccer ball structure. Then I realised that I was on defence . CTF/Assault played very similar and both played very well, however these aren't my favorite game types. I didn't take much noticed of anything while I was playing it so I can't really say much. The bad things: There were a few spawns that were a bit shabby. One of them was ontop of the attackers base. I will get back to you with a bit more in-depth game play.
Thanks for being honest with me sweeny (I knew you would) --and yeah, I know I didn't plan out the maps layout and that I did just throw down ideas and they some how worked. But normally that is how I forge. I know you know that I look towards gameplay first, and yes with this map the aesthetics are very nice to look at, and with the old weapon system it did seem kind of like I was leaning more towards aeshetics... But in the end gameplay did turn out alright and with the help of chrst refreshing the weapons to what they should have been in the first place. IMO, I make better maps by not having a set plan. I just make things and leave them be and start forging something else; if later I have the feeling they wont do well with gameplay, then theres a good chance I'll remove it, or at least rework it. So I'm sure you'll be upset to hear that with my next map I basically don't have a set plan, and with my future maps I doubt I will. But thank you again for the detailed review. To be honest, I've seen well made maps that did not have a set plan. I know my map did not have a set plan, but like I said to sweeny, that's just how I forge. I feel that if you have a set plan then you're choking the creativity that could be done for the map. I forge this way because I'm always thinking of new ideas for things; don't get me wrong, I don't actually use any of the bad ones I think of... and sure some planned out maps do turn out well. But even planned out maps could turn out bad. Now, saying that my map doesn't have recognizeable landmarks is just silly. But think what you like. To me my map is very basic and easy to navigate. They also do have one thing in common that I think you failed to either read or even just realize and that's the abstract-moderness all of them. If you have a good eye you'll notice just about every single box (open or not) is not geo-merged "perfect". I did this not because I don't know how to, I do (and I used it in the map) but because it added to the abstractness. To say that none of the things I made on the map have a common flow is again absurd. Because they do, and that is the abstract feeling they feed off each other. Heck, even the wall was made to be abstract. I could have just made it a line of boxes, but no, I took the time to carefully angle them to where they weren't just lines of boxes. But hey, if you still feel that my map doesn't have a common flow, then I don't know what to tell you. It's your opinion and I can't force you to change it. So with that said, I thank you for stating yours and I hope you understand mine. Thank you JAY, and yeah, a few of the spawns were a bit shot, I just can't really see me improving them more than they are. Maybe someone else could, but idk. =\
I dont really have time to write a long drawn out response, but I have to say that if you do not download this map that you will have to be the biggest loser ever. this map is put together perfectly and is extremely fun. Theres nothing i could suggest to make it better, from the asthetic to the gameplay this is a feature worthy map. Love, Zachary9990
Dude incredible forging skills in this, i really like the layout and the weapon layout too. Keep the work up and make sure, with your forging skills and the lack of good MLG Maps lately i like you ti try to make a good symettrical MLG Map
looks really great much better than h, sory sweeny very origional structures, great catwalks, ramps ecxt. one of your open box geomerges is kinda off, but hte awsome man cannon circly thingy is great, it looks like a tunnel opening with iceciles dorpping down upon you again very nice layout/structures/catwalks/ramps
I just noticed that I didn't mention this in the OP or any other post yet. But those "kinda off" geomerges were done that way on purpose. It's to give a more abstract feel. I know people like seeing perfect neat and what not geomerges/interlocks... but I felt I rather just go with a set theme (abstract) than being perfect. Sorry for not stating that before, and thanks for the comment ExtreemKablooie (glad you brought that up). --And yes, this is way better than H. (Though H. is still fun to play)
it looks awesome, but very very open. maybe its just the screenshots that make it look that way. otherwise, everything else looks awesome. tons of interlocking i see around the map. i really like the curved walkway, and the arch(looks a bit crooked). overall i'd give it a 4/5 which is weird since most of ur maps i really like.
i played this map with one of my friends, and it was amazing. I would definatley give it 5/5 for gameplay, extremely fun. Wouldnt change a thing. I love the part with all of the man cannons, and the part you can walk behind. Also the wall corners are fun to hide in.
That's kind of the point. =] Yeah, they do. It is somewhat, but it's a nice amount of open, and the archs are meant to be crooked, and I rather have a 4/5 (seems more honest) than a 5/5. Which is weird because 5/5 is the best. Yes, yes. They are pretty fun to hide in. They provide some good cover and you can use them to jump to places.