This is a long-ass debate so I'm not going to read everything that everyone is saying but here is how I see it; Hiding is in no way shape or form, cheating. Hiding is a tactic, it is that simple. Even if the hiding spot is obscure and a place it doesn't seem realistically reachable. IF IT IS IN THE GAME IT IS NOT CHEATING. This is a fundamental principle of Halo, if Bungie put something in the game, even by accident, it is cannot be considered cheating to use. For instance; People who hide are often called "pussies" because of the nature of the tactic. But people who only use rockets are also often called "pussies" also because the nature of the tactic. Hiding and using rockets are no different, both are at the disposal of the player and therefore cannot be considered cheating.
Thanks you very much for staing that.You basically elaborated more on when I said its an in-game tactic or strategy.Nice comparing too.
Observe::: Of course, drum's missing out on a core element of the game itself. The ability to hide is present; and thus, is available for disposal. We understand that Bungie might not intend for it to take place, but they've done nothing to fix it. It's our way of playing. If they minded so bad, they'd fix it. Drum's sort of an extremist about this. He needs to get that people won't change. It's not like he encounters HLG guys every match or even every day. Let them play the way they choose. If it's "cheating" as you suggest, then Bungie will fix it. See, guys? I can make **** up too. No one gives me a cookie, though.
Did you accuse us of 'making up ****'.I would like to know where and how I made this '****' up ,when I included proof and facts about the subject. Don't be a sore loser.
Ah, you're reading far too much into the post, bud. Take it at face value. Also, while we're barking orders, don't insist that I've lost. There will be no victory in this debate. This is so because you debate for the wrong reasons *waits for Storm to complain* I do so to learn. Many times, I'll come out of a (genuine) debate knowing more about my side of the argument than I did before. You just want to prove someone wrong. Some random guy's post that agrees with your's does not make you any form of a "winner." Halo 3 is played badly. That's the end of it. It's such a big game that folks will always find a way to manipulate it. If I were a sore loser, I'd piss you off a whole lot more. The object of "sore losing" is to get the other person back- to counter-strike. Making myself lul is in no way a counter-strike. It's just me laughing at how much you read into that dumb ass post.
I agree, there will be no end to this debate, just not for that reason. =P And I only usually whinge when you say that we debate in the wrong fasion. But since you asked... *assumes whingy voice* Dented keeps saying things that just say we arent doing things right and ignore our poiinntttsss!!!! =P
Well if theres going to be no end don't post.Halo 3 is played badly in your opinion. Obviously you or me can't see the other side of each others deabte so I'm going to stop posting in here until someone else debates,besides me and you.
this debate will likely never end...we all know hiding is going to happen nomatter what we all know hiding takes aLOT of skill we all now it is not cheating if we all understood those 3 simple points this debate would be over...
to completely revamp maps is a pain in the ass to fix mistakes. think of how many times you have submitted maps, and someone finds a crack that grenades get stuck in. you have to go fix it, but it takes a long time sometimes. for bungie to make updates for the maps "holes"... yeah.. that would be ridiculous to change the code... because people are hiding. I guess that if it became a problem (and if the majority complain about it over not complaining, then yes, it is a problem [doesn't matter what you think in relation to what the people think. not saying I'm an ultimatum, just saying what ever that outcome would be. ] ) then they would either A) use way points or B) change the map. I think they would do way points first, but if THAT became a problem, then they would fix the maps. so either way the problem will eventually be fixed. ummm.... no support has been shown to this. only completely against and proving it takes very tiny amounts of skill. no one has said it takes alot of skill to master it. only an amount. its not hard at all. I can do it. I never will though because i think its absolutely ridiculous. this is agreed. but it's been stated only using natural map cover and objects, not glitching out of the map. but two of your opinions, not points, are extremely arguable. so no, this debate will not end on that basis alone.
How is glitching out of the map,cheating? Bungie made the 'mistake' of having the glitch in their so the player would just use it as a startegy. What dissapoints me is that then Bungie 'infracts' the player for really their own mistake.
....ok. at the NewBrunswick/PEI confederation bridge, , you pay money when you go from pei --> NB. now, before, there is a ferry on the other side of the island where you paid going onto pei so NB ---> pei see the loop? tourists could get on the island and off with out paying the taxes. the people of PEI now have had their taxes ramped up due to the bridge not being paid for for a while, and after a few years of complaining the toll is now paid going to NB either way, by means of bridge or ferry. you pay at NB connecting point: if a loop or mistake is made, and people exploit it, they will get away with it for a while, but eventually it will be fixed and those who are caught will have to pay. not everyone will, but those they catch will. Finally, it's bungie's game. If they want to give you an infraction, they can do so with no reason. mind you the people would complain, so they are doing what they feel right. and instead of employing and investing a stupid amount of time to fix hiding spots, they say, "do this, you'll get infracted. now let us finish our new project so you'll quit complaining about that too"
I know its their game,but they have to understand from the players side. Bungie should see that it was their mistake and the player shouldn't suffer for doing so.But if the player continues to do so then he will face the consequences. I know Bungie can make the rules,and yes they are fair,except when it comes to these.
ok, 1. if you people think it takes very little skill, fyi getting out of the map/extreem areas require EXTREEM skill, you need pacience,speed and accuracy. 2. waypoints would completely ruin the point of cover, you almost have to say that if you have a bomb and are alone you would go behind a crate so they dont see you, anyway, it completely ruins stealth/camo
bungie is seeing from the players side. The amount of people for and pro-hiding versus the amount against it, that have complained to bungie, is far greater for against. They are acting as a democracy, and listening to the louder more obviously proven opinion. Then, based on this, they made a rule. "Don't hide. you'll get infracted." If you break the rule after they have said this, then you had better be ready to receive the consequences. They have. that's why there are so many spots found. they let it be because at first, it wasn't a problem. Now they feel that there is enough reason to act against it. And it was a mistake. A mistake that people are exploiting for their advantage. Which is what they and other people don't want and is against how they want things to be. No. It does not. I can get to any spot after being shown how to properly do it with instruction. I can get to any spot after seeing it after 3 or less tries on my own. I can figure out many more that people don't know about. Again, very low amount of skill required. your opinion is biased and, in my opinion, wrong. the waypoint system is only possibly going to be introduced to 2 vs 2. I have never played a game of 2 vs 2 objective. any team games with teams larger than that, no real problem yet anyways. if larger teams start hiding, then it may become waypoints in every game type, but for now only 2 on 2. Also, for objective game types(flag, assault), the carrier could still use cover by giving the carrier having no waypoint over their head, since you can modify their attributes. so your second point is also null, void, and wrong.
Yes their looking at the other side.It may be a democracy but its not.Most if those people are MLG players who play the game to win,not for fun.HLG is mostly for fun. Why not look at our side for once Bungie?
..you ignored my information and took from it to better your side... bungie is listening to both sides. and in their opinion, the side that has won is the side against hiding. they can't just switch sides... that would be like agreeing that same sex is ok in Canada for a few years, then after enough complaining is heard that its bad, say its wrong and outlaw it. they made their choice and are sticking to it. MLG play... cause they are MLG. not for fun. that's why bungie also made a section for them.... called MLG.
So?People cna make bad choices.Doesn't mean they have to stay loyal too it.Thats like you saying one day you decide to jump off a bridge but can't change your mind. Bungies to MLG in Halo 3.Yes they have their own playlist but almost every playlist has MLG in it.Bungie's losing the fun in their game.
If HLG truly became a problem in matchmaking and people began to complain about it, then I think bungie has one reasonable solution that would require an update. If a player stands in one area for long enough of a time (say a radius of 15-20m) then after that given amount of time a waypoint appears above their heads. This prevents players from hiding the entire match, but still allows them to surprise the enemy for a short while before having to move to another location. It sounds like a reasonable compromise between both sides.