What the f***? I just spent a long time typing up that educated, polite response to gravedigger and everyone ignores it completely? WT F***?
I actually think that it was so impressive that nobody wanted to argue it. I think you pretty much hit the nail on the head and covered all the bases in that post, that's why I +repped you : D
Marriage is the commitment of love towards another person in your life for eternity, ie; "until death do us part" - but the very basis upon which marriage is formed is constantly being ignored, with many people divorcing after finding out that they do not in fact love their partner. These people that are alright with divorce yet are still opposing gay marriage in such a fashion obviously do not know what they're talking about. As I've told the topic creator many times, I refuse to have an opinion to the topic itself, but I definitely agree with you that the civil rights must be changed to suit every member of society. People do not take marriage seriously either way besides for exploitation (which has gone on for hundreds of years, I might add; look at forced marriage), so what does it matter to people in the least other than to insight hate towards another person for a reason that they themselves to not understand. I bring the term "sexual segregation" to the table.
Gravedigger, why should you not be gay? That is the basis for your entire argument--that being gay is as wrong as robbery and killing some one. Two guys/girls getting it on and loving each other has what negative effect on society? Also, gay poeple don't choose to be gay. Most people are instinctively straight--their brains are hardwired that way. Gays, for whatever reason(messed up maturnal hormone levels, a reccessive gene or something that we dont know about), are mentally hardwired to be attracted to the same sex. Its's not a defect just a different behavioral preference. Just like some people are hardwired to have certain other behaviors/likes. One day did u wake up and say "Hey I think I'll like girls." No, you didnt. You saw some cleavage, got hard on and realized you were straight. thats how it happened.
Meh, normally I wouldn't be posting in the Debate section, but Project made me. So... [aname=0]Logically, is heterosexuality also a disease? Let's put ourselves into the situation where it was normal to be homosexual, and not heterosexual. (And not delve into the topic of babies. In this hypothetical situation, we'll say that it was homosexuality that creates babies. k?) If your child was born 'straight', could we say, "Oh, s/he has a mental illness. Damn."[/aname] Homosexuality means that you are attracted to the same sex that you are. So if you think you're a girl, but you can see your *****, that's something wholly different. ;D So if we're heterosexual, we could go to a psychiatrist and they can make us homosexual? [jumpto=0]See Section I.[/jumpto] If you tell a person that's homosexual that it's okay to be gay, you're showing tolerance, support, and love. Not, 'if you're gay, you have to be gay'. [jumpto=0]See Section I.[/jumpto] Actually, it's documented (quite a lot, actually) that the ancient Greeks had same-sex relations. Wikipedia article on Greek Homosexuality. [aname=5]So killing=gay marriages? Could killing possibly = heterosexual marriages? [jumpto=0]See Section I.[/jumpto] In any case, how does legalizing murder even come close to allowing gay marriage? You're not hurting anyone if homosexuals can marry.[/aname] And yet you said they are the same thing. Code: It's the same thing as killing people [jumpto=5]See Section VI.[/jumpto] Feeling attracted to feeling attracted to same sex is slightly redundant aswell, lol . And these natural human laws...were they written by humans? My argument against this one will basically be the same as section six's, so [jumpto=5]see Section VI.[/jumpto]
Well, we're not about to try to compare to a hypothetical scenario. We are talking about real life. Meh, I don't approve of same sex marriage, and I don't believe being gay is right. But to me, I also don't approve of many people protesting everything gays do. Yes, you can think it is wrong, I think it is wrong as a Christian. But, one is not supposed to do such things as to act violent towards gays or others because of their differences. So, if gays want to get married, I will not support the legal side of it but most definately do not support opposition to it. The point of "who are they hurting?' is quite a valid one. If you do not agree with someone's choices, such as maybe a Christian, do not continually try to force your beliefs onto another and just keep to yourself. Simply put gay people should just do as they will, but not try to force society to deem it right. And others should not try to openly supress gays and make them out to be evil. It would be better if everyone just went about their ways and did not concentrate on such things if they cannot agree. As for gay marriage, yet again I say, it's fine if you do not approve of it from a moral standpoint, but do not try to offer some pointless argument against it that takes us nowhere. Try to be friends with people for what you like in them, how well you get along, don't base your decisions on the whim of a deep prejudice. Just don't think twice about it if one of your friends is gay or not, just know they are your friends, nothing more...(Unless your trying to find a chick to get hitched to, then ask before proposing..... that would be embarassing, proposing to your "date" who is actually gay... yikes...)
I think what nemi was trying to say is that homosexuality is no more a disease or mental disorder than heterosexuality. I agree that sexual preference may differ, and yes its odd, but its no where close to a disorder or disease. Please don't take this as a personal attack... That is not the intention of this post... By saying that homosexuality isn't right you are basically saying that being homosexual is wrong. Right? I fully have to disagree with this. If homosexuality/bisexuality is wrong, then my entire existence would be considered wrong. Being non-heterosexual is something I have no control over. If you call someone/something wrong, and he/she has no control over it, you are being discriminant. That is like saying that because someone is black they are wrong, or since you are Mexican you are wrong. That, to me, is discriminatory thinking. I am a person; you are a person. We are equal. You are straight; I am not. Still, we are equal. You are Christain; I am not. Even still, we are equal. Heterosexuals get marriage privileges along with all its benifits; homosexuals do not. This is unequal treatment of what should be equal groups.
Being gay is bad for the economy, yes, yes it is. Gay = less babies which = less workers which = less economic development. HAHA! but then... gay is good for the enviroment... Gay = less babies which = less people driving, using energy, etc etc..... quite the conundrum.
Well think of it more as suicide then. The negative impact really comes back on yourself the most, but you also do have a negative impact on society as a whole. What makes most people upset about the gay marriages, is that they mess with the real purpose of marriages. It is supposed to between one man and one woman who will spend the rest of their lives together raising their children. Of course today, people just randomly get married based on different feelings, and this causes many problems like many divorces and gay marriages. By acting gay, you disrupt normal society by making other feel uncomfortable. It is really weird being around gay people, since they try to act like woman, while actually being a guy. This is why most people have trouble excepting a gay as a friend. Other problems arise from things such as gays desire to take offense to anything, and try to argue for extra rights for themselves. If you feel gay, there is no reason why you should want to get married, anyone is free to have friends, but you shouldn't be trying to do anything sexual with other guys. A big problem is from now that their are gay marriages, the gay people can adopt kids. This is unfair to the kid, who then is raised with two dads or two woman, this will create a very strange situation for the kid. Neither of their parents are really their parents, or truly understand the fatherly love they're supposed to give to their kid, since it's not really their kid. The kid has two dads that are both trying to be a mother, so they'll never really learn how to live their life right or anything. And back to showing other examples of things like this, suicide and gay marriages are wrong, although neither would affect me in any way, it is still not right for someone to say they're okay, just to avoid arguments and things. Both are done through choice, although the person doing them feels that they need to do it. And both have a negative impact on the rest of society, even though they're not affecting anyone directly the people involved. In both cases, the people involved are thinking only of satisfying their feeling, rather than about what the right thing to do is. @Project-It's not that your whole existence is wrong. The problem is, now your thinking only of trying to be gay. Although you may not be someone who is supposed to have children and raise a family, you were born with a purpose. If you can get a psychiatrist or someone to help you stop worrying about this gay stuff, you may be able to find your purpose, and then your life wouldn't be completely wasted, like you said. But this is another reason why being gay is wrong, through doing it, you can make yourself a wasted life.
*mumbles*one point that actually makes some sense around here*grunts* gay people will continue to be gay no matter what so in theory this argument is pointless besides being gay is GOOD for the envireonment! EDIT:I see what you did with that edit!!!!
This entire statement is perceived through your own eyes, how do you know how anyone else feels about the topics you've listed? Give me links to support your statements, or else I will perceive everything you've just said as false. I don't care if this was directed towards Projectt, I feel it's 'my purpose' to defend his choices. Let me ask you a question, Grave; do you think that through repeated practice a psychiatric could change your views on sexuality? This is how you're coming off to the rest of the community. Do you think that by loving another for the person they truly are is a waste of time? This is how you're coming off to the rest of the community. Do you believe that the same psychiatric that changed your views upon sexuality can change your opinion on what I'm assuming is Christianity? For a third time, this is how you're coming off to the rest of the community.
Just look around for information about it. Every scientific study and things, except a few by gay people support what I just said. Look here, the American Pediatric Association. Somewhere on here they have their studies about the married gay people and children. I'll look for more of this stuff. But what I posted is based mostly on scientific research that's been done and I've seen. I did add a few things are obvious and known, such as people ability to control their mind, if and when they choose to. Unfortunately, not everyone does, and that's why their is crime, gays, and all this other stuff. Let me ask you a question, Grave; do you think that through repeated practice a psychiatric could change your views on sexuality? This is how you're coming off to the rest of the community. Do you think that by loving another for the person they truly are is a waste of time? This is how you're coming off to the rest of the community. A psychiatrist is supposed to know what to say to help people with problems in their mind. They could change anyones views on anything, but the main thing is that the person would have to want them changed. That is why we must repeat that being gay is wrong, we need to get these people to want to change, because that is the only way that they can. And being gay, has no positive impacts on society, and people that remain gay, contribute nothing, so that is why project could end up being a wasted life, if he doesn't find help.
This is not only 100% BIASED OPINION!!! not all gay people act like woman or and not all lesbians act like men also how would you know? your not a homosexual or a ******* so get over it! also 'wasted life' as long as he accomplishes what HE wants to accomplish his life was not wasted! period. Your whole argument is based off of homosexuality being wrong well it was practiced and honored by the ancient Greeks 'natural written laws' yeah right! The greeks didn't follow your 'natural written laws' http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_ancient_Greece also 'the right thing to do' whatever they are doing is for them the 'right thing to do' also 'they don't need to marry friends is fine' well what if their 'friend' gets injured and has to go to the hospital. A homophobic 'next of kin' may just try as hard as possible to make things bad for your 'friend' please there is more to this than you think as of now please stop posting as your opinion is backed by very little to no evidence thank you and have a nice day-java. EDIT: ok now you back it up with SOMETHING ill go look at what it says and post back in a bit. DOUBLE EDIT: i couldn't find anything on homosexuals please provide an exact link until than i cannot investigate further
If you met me you would think I was straight, unless I told you. Actually the majority of homosexuals, from what I have seen are fairly normal people. You use the flaming homosexual image to stereotype an entire group, that isn't fair. I would honestly think that a kid would gladly choose to live with two homosexuals over an orphanage. Plus, with the divorce rate as it is, don't you think that having two parents would be much better than one parent, straight or not...? I know you are trying to be sincere and polite, I do see that, and I know you are trying to help. With that said: Honestly Gravedigger, it is not a choice. I did not choose to be gay. No more than you chose to be straight. If I went to a psychiatrist, they would tell me that there is nothing wrong with being gay. They would also tell me that there is no way for a gay person to become straight or vise-versa. Trust me, I know. My mom is a psychiatrist. In regards to the purpose of life thing: What if god really did have a plan, not that I believe this, but what if he did? What if his plan for me was to be born gay? To be born gay, and have to struggle through life to find my place, to find true love with another man, to go through college, major, and get a high paying job as an engineer? I believe that if there is a god, he would want everybody, including homosexuals, to be happy and find a place in their life where they feel at piece.
I have to agree with java's post. Not all gay people want to act like the opposite sex, that would be transsexuality. They prefer the love of the same sex, over the opposite sex. Does not mean that they are acting like the opposite sex. Some do, granted, but not all. Transsexuality Homosexuality
This link does nothing to support your statements, so I'm assuming that what you've said is entirely your opinion. There are many heterosexuals that also contribute nothing, why not go find them and tell them exactly why they are wrong, why they are wasting their life? Is it because of the homosexual's choice to be attracted to men is just stupid enough of a reason to inspire hate? If so, why not go attack every other religion for having 'wasted lives', as they obviously don't agree with what you're saying. Honestly, Grave; I understand where you're coming from, as I'm sure many people here do, but you really need to be more accepting of others thoughts and ideas. I recommend one of those psychiatrists that you've been going on about, they could help change your opinions. EDIT: It appears you guys have gotten to him before I did...
If they want to commit suicide why not let them? it doesn't hurt you. I mean maybe they were born depressed, then they can't do anything about it. No you shouldn't make them get psychological help! That would be trying to change who they are. Why not just be tolerant, loving, and understanding ant let them kill themselves. See what I did there? I applied the gay argument to people who want to commit suicide...Tricky little bugger arnt I?
I think people should have the freedom to marry whoever they want. gays are people just like us, just with different preferences. there is no point in argueing this, I think all the most respectable people on this site would agree that gays have the right to marry.