Edit: I've talked with people, looked through different and additional trait zones and talked with some friends from TF2, Halo 5 and Overwatch. I've concluded that the system I was aiming for would be ineffective due to the limited trait zones and abilities I can utilize in Halo 5. Generally when Halo friends think of a "Team" with a diversity of skills, a lot of people tend to think of Noble Team. Personally I think this would be a great base to build upon. The 3 class categories are this: Power: Refers to classes that focus on Dedicated direct combat. Support: Refers to classes that support the team in various ways (noshit) Assassin: Refers to classes that utilize precision weaponry or flanking to take out enemies. Before you read the classes The default trait zone belongs to the Officer Class. This is because trait zones are a *****. Alpha belongs to Sniper and Assault Beta belongs to Soldier Charlie belongs to Infiltrator Delta belongs to Juggernaut -No Radar (except Officer) -No Thrusters (except Soldier) -No Clamber (except Infiltrator) -All other main Halo 5 abilities disabled. -Cannot drive Vehicles (except Officer) The classes: Officer (Noble 1) Power Weapon: DMR (Threat Marker) Side: COG AR Grenades: 2 Splinter Grenades Trait Bonuses: Only Class that can Drive, 150% Radar Distance; can detect almost anything. No Headshot Bonus. This was THE most difficult class to make. While the other classes easily have ways to make themselves standout; even with Halo 5's sandbox; I had issues trying to make Carter standout from being just "A weaker Soldier with only splinter grenades." So I ended up giving him the ability to be the only class to drive vehicles and give him additional radar. The first part giving him usefulness due to vehicles being important. (Warthogs, Tanks are the only present vehicles as of now.) I gave him a COG AR because he can see whose hurt and who isn't. Its not a "Major" bonus but its neat and helps out. Weaknesses: -Anything anti-vehicle can hurt him as Vehicles are one of the main reasons he would be used. -Due to no Headshot bonuses; his DMR is more of a "Tag and Poke" weapon rather than a dedicated rifle. Gives him a huge disadvantage against Sniper and Soldier. Infiltrator (Noble 2) Power Weapon: Spitfire Railgun Side: Cloaknum Grenades: 2 Plasma Grenades Trait Bonuses: 130% Speed, 80% Shields and Health Infiltrator is a class I'm worried about regarding balance. Sure a magnum that makes you camo'd is very deadly and having a fast movement speed is annoying; but being squishy won't be fun either. Infiltrator is designed to harass vehicles, enemy tanks, and flank high-targets from behind. Because of the high base speed, if no vehicle is available; Infiltrator can be useful for running away with an objective like a flag. Weaknesses: -Self Awareness is the bane of every Stealth/Flank class. If the element of surprise is lacking, you can easily punish them. Officer's radar makes it more difficult for Infiltrator to get a drop on people. -A class with a powerful CQC weapon like a shotgun or SAW can easily mow the Infiltrator down due to his low HP. Sniper (Noble 3) Power Weapon: Arclight Sniper (Single-Shot reload) Side: Whispered Truth SMG Grenades: None Trait Bonuses: None Its a ****ing sniper. The Whispered Truth SMG isn't designed for CQC Combat but rather giving Sniper the ability for a recon-like ability to swiftly move to new spots to assassinate targets with long range attacks. Weaknesses: -Other Snipers -Due to his SMG not being a dedicated CQC weapon and more utility; he is very weak and vulnerable in CQC situations. Sure you can no scope, but due to the sniper's single fire state; the factors are against you. Assault (Noble 4) Power Weapon: Hydra Side: Shotgun Grenades: 4 Frags Trait Bonuses: None Assault is a class designed to hit really hard against anything. (Vehicles, People, etc) Hydra allows the user to hit both light vehicles and people hard, fast and accurate. Grenades allow AOE and can be used to spam out people from corridors. The Shotgun is his side weapon and is used to fend off targets that are too close. Weaknesses: -While the Hydra is a good range weapon; it isn't a dedicated accurate weapon like the BR, DMRs. Without lock-on; Hydra is hard to use when fighting enemies mid to long range. With his secondary being a shotgun; its hard to fight classes like Officer or Soldier when it comes to range. Juggernaut (Noble 5) Power Weapon(s): Tartarus Turret / Relic SAW (makes you move slower) Side: 6-Shot H1 Magnum Grenades: None Trait Bonuses: 200% Shields ; 150% Health ; 80% Movement Speed; No Headshots; 80% Jump Juggernaut is a class designed to have high DPS and tank damage. Juggernaut is a pure power class and requires a team to take out classes that can deal a lot of damage to him. The Tartarus Turret allows him to move a bit faster AND take more damage as a tank. (More than the Relic SAW. Which is only there just in case the turret is dropped due to weapon pickup being disabled.) Weakness: -If not self aware; any class can sneak up from behind (especially Infiltrator) and assassinate you. -Being focuse fired by multiple classes (regardless of who it is) will eventually null his bulk as any tank needs team support to survive. Soldier (Noble 6) Power Weapon: H2 BR (Laser Sight) Side: AR Extended Mag Grenades: 2 Frags Trait Bonuses: Thrusters Enabled. Thrusters are better than average Halo 5 ones. Soldier is a class designed for one thing; killing anything that moves. He is a pure dedicated combat class. The H2 BR allows the soldier to be precise, deadly and give off a high damage output all at the same time. His Thrusters are faster and better than the default Halo 5 Thrusters; and hes the only Class that has them enabled. The thrusters allow the Soldier to be more aggressive and combat oriented. Weakness: -Due to his pure-combat role; he has to rely a lot on support (like Vehicle, Long-Range and tanking). -Lacks a Heavy-hitting weapon; despite being a combat class. (No Sniper, No Hydra, No Saw, etc). In terms of maps; I'm trying to avoid choke as I'm trying to avoid stalemates and other boring situations revolving nothing happening. Also some classes may be TOO powerful in those situations. Each map has the "Main Path" and then 3-4 Flank-paths. It is 8v8 gamemode. Spoiler: Old Class System This is something I've always wanted to do in Halo 5; but I'd like feedback from people that know what they are doing with forge and Halo. When I mean Class-Based, I don't mean something like Halo 4 or CoD, but something more on the lines of TF2 and Overwatch. For a while I've been experimenting with different weapon pad glitches, scripts and FOV-out filters to create a game mode built around this concept, even making a crude remake/revamped version of TF2's 2fort map. To replicate a class selection, you spawn in a room with 4 teleporters, each with the symbol of the set of classes symbolized by 1 of each Halo 5 Powerup. (Overshield, Camo, Speed, Damage). When you enter a room, you have 3 paths with the weapons and trait zones for each class. Once you enter, you cannot switch until you respawn. There is a kill barrier in each one so if you screw up, you can kill yourself there to redo it. Each class is stuck with the weapons they start with; infinite ammo is enabled (due to the issue of running out of ammo out on the battlefield.) By Default: -Sprint Disabled -Thrusters Disabled -Radar Disabled -FOV Out (so classes can't scope in) Default traits can be overruled by certain class traits. The Classes: Damage (or Strike Classes) are designed to be your infantry/damage classes: 1. Infantry has with a Hydra/BR. Multi-purpose class 2. Grenaider has with a Grenade Launcher and a River of Light Hydra. 4 Frags also. AOE class. 3. Gunner has an AFD Saw and an extended mag AR. DPS class Overshield (or Support Classes) are designed to assist your team in situations. 1. Officer has a trait where his radar is enabled and extended. Can detect anybody that isn't camo'd. He runs a DMR (Threat Marker) and H1 Magnum. Combat-Support Class 2. Enforcer has a Lawgiver and SMG. 4 Splinter Grenades. Area-Of-Denial Class 3. Juggernaut has a Tartarus Gavel SAW and an AR. Has a trait where he has additional HP and Shields, but at the cost of reduced speed. Tank Class Speed classes are designed for well, Speed and are better equipped with securing objectives. 1. Recon has a Whispered-Truth BR and a tactical magnum. Trait enabled where has increased movement speed, radar enabled, better thrusters enabled. He has less HP and shields though. Flank/Objective Class 2. Knight is equipped with a Prime Sword (SPNKR Prime buffs on a sword.) with a 6-shot H1 Magnum. CQC Class 3. Mechanic is equipped with a SMG and gunfighter. He has a trait where he deals less damage than other classes; but is the only class that can use vehicles. His loadout allows him to spawn with a warthog (team support) or a wasp (combat support). Other vehicles are available on the map that only HE can use such as scorpion tanks and Mantis. Note: You can still be hijacked. Idk if theres a way to disable that; I couldn't find one. Camo (or Stealth Classes) are designed for indirect combat and harassment. 1. Sniper has a single-round sniper (reload after 1 shot) and a magnum. Long-Range Class, FOV is default so Sniper can zoom in properly. 2. Assassin has an Energy Sword and a Prophet's Bane Magnum (it camo's the user when equipped). 3 Plasma Grenades. Infiltration Class 3. Commando has a Void's Tear Plasma Caster and a Sound Damp AR. 3 Plasma Grenades. Harrassment Class. FOV is default so Commando can zoom in properly. Gamemodes Eh mostly stuff like Strongholds/King of the Hill/Assault/CTF. Usual objective-based modes. Yes I understand some of these classes need work and improvements. I'd like people's feedback and criticism. Maybe even an entire revamp of the class system might be needed. Hell maybe this game mode shouldn't exist.
This would be cool. The only problem I see is you would need to use traits likely which would require use of the minigame gamemode. Strongholds, CTF and even normal slayer using the base minigame mode can require a lot of effort to pull off.
So the immediate gameplay issue is that players do not naturally spawn with their class of choice. They spawn and then select a class via teleporter which I then assume takes you to a spawn room similar to that of TF or OW. In those games, the mechanic is fine because it is natural to the game and spawn killing is surprisingly low/hard to accomplish in those games. If you are going to replicate that, you need to ensure that spawn camping is ultra difficult if not downright impossible. You gotta remember that this is still Halo and the natural inclination for players is to get kills by any means necessary. Having a zone to defend might not be enough to actually stop people from going out of their way to spawn trap. NOw, this isn't to shoot you down. I think it's just a really early stage thing you need to consider when you initially start a build for a map in this style. About the classes. If you look at a game like OW for example, it has a HUGE hero selection to choose from and those heroes all carry some kind of rock, paper, scissors function in relation to other heroes. Blah counters blah, etc. Currently it seems as though you have your classes fleshed out to reflect on their names, rather than a checks and balances system. I think it would really strengthen gameplay to have a system like that. Something to consider.
Regarding spawn camp, I do have methods to make it difficult (boundaries, multiple exits, spawn camp kill button, teleporters, two spawn rooms) And I find the Rock Paper Scissor balance system will be difficult and not fun in Halo 5's sandbox. Its more of fullfilling a certain roll you think is best suited for you. The counters in this game are situational. (Such as a Sniper vs an Enforcer in long range. Even then it depends if the sniper can aim.) Also with making a map for this mode is important; how else would I test the classes and flow of the game mode?
In Reach we played a gametype called elimination that was class based. It had a neutral bomb or flag and it was round based. By making it elimination based it avoided some of the spawning issues but if you are going with an Overwatch/TF2/Paladins approach you need to nail class balance and make sure that getting one kill on the offensive side of things has as much of an impact as it can have in those games. I don't think the custom options are really available to do this justice in Halo 5. If I were you I would look into Shadowrun as it was the basis for what we played in Reach and will probably help you expand on this idea even more. Incoming OW/TF2 rant that has nothing to do with any of this. Not sure about Paladins but Overwatch and TF2 rely heavily on soft counters that are typically based on the players ability to aim and position themselves properly. Example: In a vacuum Mcree could be seen as a hard counter to tracer but in practice it is more of a soft counter as both players abilities at each character create a wide range of variance between encounters. This is also ignoring the fact that the game is heavily based on teamplay compared to TF2. So this variance grows even more depending on the amount of peel, healing and other forms of pocketing each player is getting. The R.P.S. aspects comes more in the form of composition versus composition which has never been properly balanced because there is always a healer or tank that throws the whole thing out of wack on top of players who started one tricking characters like Tracer because people realized it is worth doing because the versatility in play style that comes with the character by being the least linear character in the game. TF2 is more of a shooter than Overwatch and has a higher skill floor and ceiling than Overwatch from a mechanical standpoint which emphasizes advanced movement and aiming ability and team coordination becomes less important even though it is still important. It is just much more focused on being a mechanical god than a team player.
I've been wanting to create a game mode like this for a while now in Halo 5 but always ran into the trouble of the limited sandbox we have at our disposal and the difficulty it would be to balance everything. If you actually want to pursue this, my suggestion for you is to instead of having different sub-classes within each class, start out with a person for each class and hone that before expanding. Also with that in mind, put your priority on balance however you decide to balance it.
because it's traits (meaning you could only have a max of five classes, Alpha through Delta, and the non-class class), you can do absolutely anything to balance. Not just weapon, but if you need to slow someone down or give them more shield, you can do that too... At any rate, I would echo the need for anyone wanting to do this and have more than just a few people play on their personal map, would need to consider what everyone else wants too. That is balance and fairness. You do need a trait for each player that is able to be countered by the others. I'd set up your classees as you deem fit, then make a test map with just a few obstacles and a switch for assigning the label or traits to the player who presses it (Activator). Go around and experiment just fighting as each of the classes. Keep in mind, you are putting the choice all on player preference, and players will prefer the one they win with the most. If everyone is choosing the same class, it is broken. Good luck!
Since everybody is questioning how the balancing in this would work let me boil it down. Counters are based off situations rather than Class vs Class. Examples being: A Sniper has an advantage when it comes to long-range engagements. A Knight has an advantage when it comes to CQC An Enforcer has an advantage when it comes to chokepoints. Its not like OW where Class A can hard/soft counter Class B in almost any situation. I did host a public testing lobby on Halo 5 with this gamemode at least a month ago to get a general idea on balancing. However because of it's TDM nature, it is difficult to see how the support classes work out in a team-based environment. So this is what I concluded: Sniper was nerfed. Originally it was the regular Halo 5 sniper; but this allowed people to completely annihilate anybody in both Long and Short-range engagements. And because of how the other classes worked at the time, Sniper was unmatched in what he does. Even when it was 2 shot, it was still incredibly powerful. So I kept it 1 shot so it forced players to determine whose the most dangerous target. Soldier was buffed. Originally he ran a AR instead of a BR. By adding the BR, it allowed him to completely reach the "Multi-Purpose" role he was designed to be. I removed the 3rd Strike Class (Rifleman) because he was outclassed by Sniper and really didn't have an impact on balancing and felt out of place. I gave the Rifleman BR to Soldier. I ended up moving Gunner (originally a Support) to Strike and changed him up a bit. Juggernaut no longer had a turret gun; instead I gave him a SAW. (This is because weapon drop is disabled, and people kept dropping the gun meaning it disappeared. Because I gave him a SAW, I gave Gunner the AFD SAW so he'd still be the better DPS class than Juggernaut.) List kind of goes on with changes.
I ended up revamping the entire concept completely. I also was thinking: "Whats the point of having 12 classes if its only 8v8? It leaves at least 4 classes out in the cold." I feel like it is very different as no class crosses paths with another one in terms of gameplay.
What you improved does sound a lot better from what you originally had. I'd be interested to see this be tested.
Well currently I am testing certain mechanics to see if certain improvements can be made right now actually lol. Personally I think the old concept would work if it wasn't Halo 5; but this works too lol
You should put this in some of the testing lobbies here on Forgehub Click the link to check out some of the lobbies