That's what it looks like. Goat: I don't like key maps Multi: You don't like using your brain Goat: No I don't like clambering everywhere chasing the key Multi: You're being edgy Goat: What have I said that's being edgy? Multi: You think the AR is a valid weapon Goat: No, I said it's a better weapon than the BPR if you want an auto on the map Multi: DO YOU THINK YOU'RE MORE RETARDED THAN ME?!
I had to say it like 4 different places because people kept messaging me and the other staff questions about the contest. Kinda hard to miss tbh, but I'll find them when I get home
Lol. Clambers aren't indicative of a key map, I already said if you don't like clambering that's fine. I don't either. You literally told me in a party that the reason the "pros" don't like playing arcanum is because it's boring. Those were your words not mine, nevermind the fact that the highest voted maps were Aerocrest and Sanctuary lmao. You've made several posts that were directed at me in slight, I don't care to find them right now sorry. Whatever your personal problems are you project them on Forgehub way too much. I texted you about this and you didn't even honor it with a response so excuse me if I don't want to deal with your emotional lashings on a public Halo forum. The conversation didn't follow that path at all but I really don't care to continue this.
No, but your design for the map was to make the player without the key take a convoluted path. In theory, it makes sense, but it is annoying in practice, and I made a blanket statement because it is - and will be for the foreseeable future - the only key map. I do think simply opening doors is ultimately a primitive usage of the mechanic, but I obviously don't dislike the concept of altering the map with a pickup. Perhaps I may have hastily worded it that way, but that's not the implication. It's a frustrating map to play because the simple act of moving and shooting is discouraged in order to force usage of the key. I don't need you to remind me of how stale competitive players preferences are, but they don't like maps that get in the way, and that's how I feel about key maps Arcanum. If you can't move and you can't shoot, then why are you playing a shooter? I also had text messaging disabled until yesterday. If you messaged me I didn't see it, but I appreciate the gesture.
For the record I was referring to a real Halo environment, not one with Spartan Abilities. "Inverted" Camo would be stupid in H5 it'd just promote Spartan Charge spam lol.
The pro critiques on Arcanum from the survey ranged from "The key doesn't do **** its useless" To "The key is literally so op" Maybe, just maybe. Pros don't know what the **** they're talking about and never have. And maybe after 10 years of making maps MAYBE I trust my intuition on level design more than people who are only playing for money and thought Sanctuary was the best map in the tourney. I've played it enough and watched other people play it enough to know that it works. If you don't find it fun, that's fine I'm not asking to you. But when you start making idiotic blanket statements like "key maps are boring and dumb" then I'm going to lose patience with you. I don't really care if you like it, I didn't even expect most people to like it I even said in my commentary, I only wanted to play it with a small group of friends. The fact that it's gotten the great reception it has is fine by me. I really don't care if you find it frustrating. But don't say something doesn't work when it does.
I never said it didn't work. I just said I found the premise of the map - and any key map that would have followed the template - boring, because chasing the key for the privilege of taking a normal path and getting into an actual gun battle was not appealing to me; and I suggested that perhaps that was the reason the tournament people thought it was "gay" (and according to you, it wasn't, so who really cares what randoms think.) Using my brain to outsmart my opponents is the reason I play competitive shooters. Using my brain to calculate the trajectory needed to land on a ledge without succumbing to this game's shitty physics engine is not. Hence my opinion. As for the "slights" from Sunday, if you preceived them to be passive aggressive it's because you were saying the exact same thing I had said to you about the AR and Spartan Charge when we were on my map. So my tone reflected what appeared to be a pivot. Furthermore, you still haven't explained why my comments about the AR are "edgy". But it's fine if you want to drop it. I just dislike this notion that I'm "trolling" because I have "issues". I may change my mind about a position I take, but I don't say anything without articulating why I feel that way.
https://www.forgehub.com/threads/1v1-forge-contest-discussion.156679/page-2#post-1694349 This post was made before we cut the 5th judge or had the start date figured out. The other shout outs were on discord and waywo back when the contest was first getting hammered out. Considering how normally vocal you are when you see room for improvement as well as a judge for the contest, I was under the impression that you were reading the posts on the contest discussion as well as the waywo posts leading up to it. I'm just pissed because this could have been avoided.
Guys guys guys Halo 5 is the reason for all of this The game is not enjoyable so how do you expect to come to agreements on things Spartan charge, ground pound, clamber, stabilize, the whole weapon sandbox AIDS I say **** IT ALL after this contest and everyone designs for classic settings Maybe Ill reinstall halo 5 then
I don't agree with altering weapons and spawns, because I see them as a part of the complete experience. On a professional level, these elements are a very impactful part of how people experience your creations. So, I see it as just as much a part of the map as geometry is. The need to alter any part of the map should be seen as a shortcoming of the design. In my opinion, of course. What I did today:
@Sethiroth I wasn't referencing you at all. I've always seen you as someone that forges when you're motivated, but not specifically for money. You've been very motivated to participate in contests in general, even when there isn't money at stake. I literally can't think of anyone that only forges for money. By the way, it's Chunk, with an N, lol.
Oh I never doubted you were telling the truth, but if I knew we had control over this contest, I would've held off the announcement to 1: establish time frames, with no grace period 2: establish my philosophies on how I'm going to judge (removing weapons and such) 3: receive feedback, and in turn tell people what I want, and 4: post all the threads and write ups myself to avoid this confusion Pros are idiots. What's new. Sure and I respect that opinion, which is why I even made sure my perspective was public ahead of time as well. I knew some people wouldn't be happy. In a professional environment spawns and weapons could be tweaked in a heartbeat, the geometry not so easily. I care about the design of a map, not so much the weapons and gibberish that fill the technical side. That's easy to place and easier to fix. I'm only taking this stance because it would feel cheap to cheat a good design out of proper recognition because there was a bad spawn. In comparison to Hangar 2.0 which is perfectly tuned. I don't give a **** about how fine tuned it is if the design is lame. Feel free to start a discussion thread and we can take a vote, I'll honor the results. But I'm warning everyone that taking the black & white approach is going to pull really controversial results.
@MultiLockOn In a professional environment spawns and weapons could be tweaked in a heartbeat, the geometry not so easily. During the testing and creation, sure. But, I see submitting a map closer to shipping it on a game. Once it's shipped, needing to alter something upon release would surely be seen as a shortcoming.
If the judges and staff agree to alter the weapon layout of maps submitted, then based on the suggestions posted here, there should be a rule established: Judges reserve the right to remove the pick up items from the map should they perceive them to be unfit for the design. Forgers also reserve the right to opt out of weapon changes upon submitting, whereby the map is disqualified should the weaponset be considered a significant issue with how the map functions. Two birds, one stone. This way, if you do not want your map to be played without its weapons, or are confident in your weaponset, you can opt out of that. And it should be opt out, because there will be less Forgers who are 100% confident in their weaponset. So long as this is explicitly communicated and documented and it doesn't extend beyond weapons, I don't think it will be exploited And I don't think a map should be disqualified for having one bad spawn point either, but that can be overlooked depending on severity and it shouldn't be tampered with.
I don't understand how that's any different from how I've been saying we're going to judge the contest thus far. Apart from the opting out rule which I don't know why anyone would agree to. That would only hurt them.
The opt out rule is the difference. I would opt out of it because I would be submitting a map that functions the way I intend it to. I don't want anyone tinkering with it, whether it's 343 or a judging panel. Bungie removed the Overshield from Think Twice because they didn't use classic powerups in Reach's Team Slayer playlist. There ended up being an entire room with no pickup in it because of that. Similarly, 343's change to the powerups on Hangar drastically altered the flow of the map. Say what you will about the design, but the fact of the matter is that it was altered from the way it was intended to be played.