Community Cartographers

NONE of the cartographers have the expertise to actually sit in a position as the mouthpiece of the community, But at the very least War is extremely open minded. Which is important to be in the position that he's in. Which is why I have no issue with him.

If we wanted qualified level designers to rule over us then so be it, but let the community elect them in so we have a large enough panel of knowledgeable forgers that won't dictate us the way the current system does. No matter what map I make right now, with Duck as a CC it will never get anywhere near matchmaking, he's shown time and time again he can't see past his bias and he's far from being open minded about map design.

I feel the same exact way. When I'm in a party talking to Fated I have no issues with him, he's a pretty cool guy honestly. But the past is enough of a reason for me to not trust his intentions.

 

My first time hearing a cartographer talk consisted of this:

"Wow, I can't believe <maker of the map he was looking at> did this. I thought <maker of the map> knew better than that, maybe not <completely unrelated person pulled from nowhere simply for the sake of insulting him> though."

And this happened twice amidst the conversation for no reason.

I thought it was ridiculous that the CC went out of their way to insult the other forger behind their back, especially considering I think most of the community would argue that the forger who was underhandedly insulted is actually both a good designer and forger. It makes it look pretty clear that that CC's personal bias towards this person gives them little to no chance of getting a map through the Cartographers which is just unfair. Not to mention the other CC in the party just went along with the insults. I agree with Chunk's rationale on the rest of it, but this kind of stuff is uncalled for.

That's all I really have to say as that was my only interaction with a CC. I'm also out unless I'm needed in the discussion again.

 

Wow.

The fact that we need this thread is an embarrassment to the forge community.

Chunk and Multi nailed it.

 

Biggest revelation in this thread is that people actually played H2A.

 

That was a good game!

When it worked

 

I felt like I was the only person who didn't. Everybody's been bringing it up and I've just been creeping the thread

 

So basically...

 

1) Community Cartographers can get their maps into matchmaking, which should be a right that should be relinquished when you become a CC. If you have watched The Office, CCs gettings maps into matchmaking is like when Dwight chooses himself as the Hay King.

2) Most CCs show a clear bias towards each other and their close friends. Everyone except the CCs and their close friends says this is the case.

3) They organize test lobbies AND participate in the feedback stage during them. I can't think of any ethical process where organizers of a test environment are allowed to offer their take on the matters at hand. Your job as a CC should be to gauge the community's interest during testing, not to persuade them. I can't tell you how many times someone raised legitimate concerns with a map only to have them ignored or dismissed by a CC.

4) They are very poor at communicating with the community, whether it's sharing information selectively or not engaging with the communities they are supposed to represent. If you are too busy to engage with the community, why would the community have any reason to believe that you have enough time to do the other parts of being a CC?

5) To my knowledge, they have never in any official or organized capacity asked the community for feedback in regards to how the CCs are doing. In every instance, feedback and criticism is always initiated by the community in response to something the CCs did wrong. It almost comes across as if the CCs don't care and/or think they're doing a good job.

 

Lol

 

Its hard for me to dive deep into this as I'm in the process of moving out of two states and closing a business but wanted to say that I'm reading the comments and listening. I'd like to address some of these issues head on, it may take time but we'll figure something out. If our group seems to be biased, myopic or driven on a single track then perhaps we should introduce new members into the Cartographer group. This expansion will allow us to operate more effectively while enhancing our diversity, versatility and community awareness.

We are all extraordinarily passionate about multiplayer, gameplay, and map design within the Halo universe and our goal has always been to serve the Halo community by curating the highest quality matchmaking content possible. With structural change and new members, I'm confident we can live up the standards we set for ourselves.

Moving forward, our ultimate vision for this group is to ensure that it will be comprised of the most knowledgeable and talented designers from our community. The curation team should be highly versatile and effective, utilizing both internal and external resources to ensure our selections receive the proper stress testing and development required.

We will be creating a list of candidates and discussing their potential contribution to our team. In the meantime, here is the criteria we will set for consideration to the group:

• To identify, select, and prepare the best community forge maps for matchmaking integration based on specified matchmaking tasks
• To monitor community trends in an effort to better inform decisions regarding the prioritization of matchmaking tasks
• To act as a bridge between the forge community and 343 Industries
• A clear specialization within a specific category of maps with a deep understanding of maps within that category
• The ability to select maps based exclusively on merit and to not allow opinions of the map’s author or other biases affect the decision
• The ability to articulate their understanding of said maps at a high level and to discuss the merit of selected maps with others
• The ability to guide selected maps through every stage of the development process leading to a hand-off to the internal sustain team, including preparing a spawn system, weapon set, and ensuring that maps are contained and performant
• A clear link to the part(s) of the community where maps within their category come from and a broad awareness of maps being created within that category and community trends which affect it
• The ability to coordinate and cooperate with other team members and to take on a leadership role when their category is the subject of a matchmaking task

 

Maybe having a new forum section specifically dedicated to news and announcements from the CC's would help the transparency issue. I know they could fit in either the Halo discussion or Forge discussion forums, but having everything together and in an easily accessible area- rather than random threads that can get buried in the more general forums- would make it clear to an extent how much the CC's are actually communicating with the community, for better or for worse.

 

That'd be nice but, again, they aren't supposed to be telling us anything really. The times we do hear something is when someone spoke out of turn and the information got leaked. Don't get me wrong, full transparency would be really amazing, but that's not how things work, and I fully understand why it needs to be that way.

 

@NOKYARD

 

?

 

You raise a serious issue and one that shouldn't be taken lightly. I completely agree that our selections for matchmaking should remain without preferential treatment or bias. I just recalled Nokyard telling one of 343's multiplayer level designers that he has more maps included in matchmaking than any of them combined.

 

I dunno man, where does it say the CC have to tell us anything? Half of the CC have been helpful to me the other half has not. They offer me advice when I ask, as does the community and most members in this discussion. I have learned a lot from most of you. That being said I don't understand how some of the CCs are even CCs. Some of them are worse forgers than me, and that's saying something. As for being involved in parties and having their own clique I wouldn't know that. I'm not really involved with the community outside of Forge Hub. Do I wish they would tell us more about playlists and so on? Of course. Am I gonna lose sleep over it? Lol no.

EDIT: I would also like to say @aPK raises some great points, and I think I speak for the community when I say we'd like to see those points addressed.

EDIT 2: I'd like to nominate myself for a CC position. I'm highly unqualified but enjoy power. Plus this sounds like it may look good on a resume so I'm in. Thanks.

 

Ah gotcha. Well Nokyard is more of the exception because he's a Cartographer that specializes in a very niche gametype (nothing wrong with that), and like I said in my first post he's excluded from my critiques.

 

I'm italian and I'm a member of the biggest Halo community in Italy, I have a strong relalationship with the head of it and I would say they'd certainly appreciate a collaboration. If you have in mind something more than just an "english Forge" feel free to message me!

 

Do Italians forge Grifball courts?