Simulacra (Halo 4 Asymmetrical Design)

Discussion in 'Halo and Forge Discussion' started by AtlasIsShruggin, May 12, 2012.

  1. AtlasIsShruggin

    AtlasIsShruggin Forerunner

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    SIMULACRA

    With Halo 4 on the horizon I've begun thinking of map layouts that would specifically work with Halo 4. Notably at the moment I've been testing different designs that use balanced weapon drop areas. Simulacra uses a system of room to room sight lines that give players multiple tactical options when a weapon drop is announced. The weapon drop system makes me particularly excited as it lends itself to asymmetrical designs, something I favor.

    To test the map I've been using default TU reach settings along with MLG settings with two weapons on the map, sniper and grenade launcher. I've also been testing the map with a Halo 4 variant which mimics classic jump height and movement while using sprint to test sizing for Halo 4. The gametype is a variant of spartan skirmish and so no power weapon appear by default on this map. I've also set the map up for one flag, one bomb, 3-plots, and oddball. I'm specifically leaving out headhunters and KOTH as I have set the map up for the Hoarders gametype and plan on setting up the Halo Tactics gametype in the future. Hoarders is a gametype I really enjoy and Halo Tactics will allow for good testing of sight lines and how you can be exposed from multiple directions when moving into one.



    I'll continue to update the map as Halo 4 draws closer and more information on the game gets released. Look to this thread for updates and new gameplay videos.


    UPDATES WITH VIDEOS​
    First Version
    Special Thanks to Nak3d Eli for providing this Gameplay footage
    NAK3D ELI ON THE SIMULACRA BETA

    First Update
    This is a game of MLG Slayer we played a few days ago. I'm sure you will very quickly see some differences in the aesthetics of the map. The reason for the change was to measure the map out to make the floor underneath the man cannon and out where blue team originally spawned at the same level. This also caused the original sniper room to drop by .3. I've also adjusted where blue and red teams spawn at the start and moved the sniper to blue teams old spawn location. The next step for the map will be to measure all of the sight lines and place some strategic blockers in place to force players to move more to get off shots room to room. The basic principle behind the sight lines and room to room interaction will remain the same however. I'm also ironing out some respawn issues.

    MLG Slayer
     
    #1 AtlasIsShruggin, May 12, 2012
    Last edited: May 17, 2012
  2. neverendinghalo

    neverendinghalo Forerunner
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    That actually looks pretty damn nice, I know this probably doesn't matter but I like what you did with the Brace Larges and Bridge smalls in the middle
     
  3. Psychoduck

    Psychoduck Spartan II
    343 Industries Cartographer Forge Critic Senior Member

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    I guess I wasn't the only one recording footage in that lobby, eh? This was fun to play, although it felt a bit too similar to Unconquered in some ways, mainly visually. It just didn't stand out that well. Still, this is quite well designed, and pretty fun to play.
     
  4. AtlasIsShruggin

    AtlasIsShruggin Forerunner

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    Thanks! The bridge aesthetic was actually a suggestion by Xzamples so I can't take credit for that. I haven't been going into my Halo 4 designs to concerned with aesthetics as it's all going to be translated when the game comes out. (I'm also working on another asymmetrical map called Lunartic and a symmetrical map called Composure. All three maps are designed with Halo 4 in mind.) I typically use brace larges because its very easy to raise and lower the piece to open/close sight lines. It makes working on design much easier.

    I can see how you could see the aesthetic similarities with Unconquered. I think I explain that pretty well above. As for standing out from the rest of the maps that night I would be lying if Nak3d Eli's response to the map didn't put a ridiculously large smile on my face.
     
  5. Eightball

    Eightball Forerunner
    Forge Critic Senior Member

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    Nice to see you forging maps again, bro. This looks pretty solid. I'll have to check it out sometime.

    Edit: Song name, in the first vid?
     
    #5 Eightball, May 12, 2012
    Last edited: May 12, 2012
  6. AtlasIsShruggin

    AtlasIsShruggin Forerunner

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    The song is the Ryan Gosling Remix of No Light, No Light by Florence + The Machine. I highly recommend downloading their album Ceremonials, I've been addicted to it.

    And it's not that I stopped forging, I just started forging in different communities. I disagree (more often than not) on what posts get moderated on this site and what posts don't. I tend to get frustrated pretty easily when I see this on sites. But I miss you guys so I'll be back more and more often :)

    Another reason you haven't seen a lot of new work from me is the fact that Unconquered was being worked on since July 2011 only being completely finished this February. It's the longest R&D time I've ever put into a map and I hope it shows in Matchmaking. I'm trying to bring this method of forging and testing over a long period of time to my Halo 4 designs so that the quality shows even though they will be finished fairly early in Halo 4's life. Also when building Midas, as soon as I got word that it was also up for matchmaking I was distracted by preparing that map for matchmaking submission and testing the hell out of it rather than posting it.

    Now that I have two maps in matchmaking I'm ready to move on to new designs that look forward to Halo 4. So I wouldn't expect anything but Betas until then. That being said I am testing the three new designs, Simulacra, Lunartic, and Composure I'll show the other two when they are a bit more polished.

    Lunartic is a asymmetrical donut map that doesn't play like a donut map. The center is designed so each corner of the map plays differently and encourages movement to each of the four areas. Composure is an arena style symmetrical map that uses triangles to create interesting lines of sight. You can look forward to map previews of these throughout the summer.
     
  7. SecretSchnitzel

    SecretSchnitzel Donald Trump
    Forge Critic Senior Member

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    My favorite map from you at the moment. Fun games. Love abusing the JP on it.
     
  8. AtlasIsShruggin

    AtlasIsShruggin Forerunner

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    Thanks Schnitzel! Still really looking forward to your rat's nest re-imagining! I've always had mixed feelings on jetpack, but for me what it comes down to is that jetpackers should be able to move from floor to floor more efficiently without creating new and higher power positions. When building Unconquered, I literally lowered the ceiling until the jetpack user in the game started complaining. I think this is a way to go about enclosed designs that keeps jetpack in a balanced role for the map. So I wouldn't consider it abuse, but jetpack away :)
     
  9. xDTx Kaos

    xDTx Kaos Forerunner
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    Funny, I was gonna ask for the song name as well. The map looks pretty solid in terms of layout. The only thing I saw as a problem was in the gameplay vid. Whoever was recording never went to one side of the map(opposite of the u-shaped dip with the healthpack and grav lift.) that could have just been him considering I've never played on here. Hopfully you can put some nice aesthetics on here in halo 4. Looks promising. I would offer to playtest but my Internet has been crap lately. So good luck.
     
  10. AtlasIsShruggin

    AtlasIsShruggin Forerunner

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    Nak3d Eli's skill is ridiculously higher than anyone else in that game. The sides are really useful for flanking and safe movement throughout the map, problem is if you have Eli's skill you can just chill in the center and dominate. There was a major skill gap in that game though. I'll upload some future games on it from my perspective, actually I think I can upload the same game but from my perspective. That could be embarrassing :) but it would give you a better idea of how the map flows.
     
  11. Skyward Shoe

    Skyward Shoe BTB Legend
    Forge Critic Senior Member

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    The game I played with you and Duck and Eli was a lot of fun, the game was really fast paced and player flow was constantly shifting. Visually I agree that it looked a little basic, but I understand that a specific gameplay style is the real point. Not being a fully competitive player makes it harder to differentiate maps that look similar. Great job so far!
     
  12. Noooooch

    Noooooch Forerunner
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    The Spartan Skirmish idea is pretty clever. How are the hills set up for that? In the Invasion gametype? Neat-o.

    Pretty sure the lot of us will be bringing over our maps from Reach into Halo 4 at first, I know I am. I guess we can all say that our maps H4 betas, lol.

    I didn't like the map too much at first, but you really cleaned it up and 'gave it a haircut' which really picked up the map's pace and kept the map looking nice and clean. Removing the bottom floor was a good idea.*

    Slayer has been a lot of fun to play on this map. Not sure which team it is, but I know that if I initially spawn near the teleporter receiver and take a hard right then I can get probably lob a nice nade into an enemy's players face and one shot him for the first strike. I've done it several times now and I really enjoy a good initial skirmish, like Unconquered.
     
  13. AtlasIsShruggin

    AtlasIsShruggin Forerunner

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    I too like the initial skirmish in maps.

    To answer the question on the gametype. I use Spartan Skirmish, adjust player speed to 120%, the jump height to 125%, and player gravity to 150%. Classic setting essentially. Keeping sprint in the loadouts will help you test the size of the map with the incrreased player speed with sprint. Then I set up all the Tiers to have the same loadouts so it stays continuous through the game. Dmr starts with an AR. There is no armor lock load out as that will be absent from Halo 4. Also make sure to make the capture time for the drops at 30 secs not 10 secs. It'll allow you to test the locations more thoroughly and you won't have 15 gravity hammers at the end of the game (I made this mistake the first time and it was a ridiculous game at the end) Also when you are setting up the map for invasion skirmish make sure to set your power weapons to "none" on invasion. That way they won't show up.
     
  14. Zombievillan

    Zombievillan Ancient
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    So I'm confused. Weapon drops as in, certain weapons spawn in "hills" instead of designated spawn points? That's a system in halo 4? I'm not up to date with the gameplay in halo 4. But you sir, have inspired me to start some layout plans to get a map made for halo 4 but build it in reach so when 4 comes out I can have a decent map built quickly. I'll build it & test it in reach & it'll be all ugly cuz I'll just use whatever blocks fit the part. Then I won't worry about aesthetics till 4 gets here.

    Yours is lookin pretty sweet here though.
     
  15. cluckinho

    cluckinho Well Known
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    The map is great, but I think it's a little soon to build a map for Halo 4. We have only seen around 20 seconds of gameplay along with some other tidbits of information. Who knows, maybe something has yet to be revealed could drastically change gameplay. Plus, we have yet to see 343's take on Forge. I have a feeling you'll want to build something much more ambitious once you see it.

    Not trying to be the turd in the punchbowl, I just think you should wait.
     
  16. Redy

    Redy Hipster
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    I really like the way you play, faster and springy. And you made a nice one with that grenade launcher right there in the Video. Congratz
     
  17. AtlasIsShruggin

    AtlasIsShruggin Forerunner

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    No, from what I understand weapon drops will be announced giving players a limited amount of time to secure the area where the weapon will "drop" Unfortunately Spartan Skirmish is the closest we will come to this system. I'm simply testing locations. The other important test to think about, is size. In Halo 4 we will have increased movement with sprint. This means forgers will have to think about new sizing as players will be able to cross maps more quickly. This part is still up in the air though. We still don't know if 343 is increasing movement speed to make the game play faster or if they will be making the maps bigger. Personally I'm hoping for a bit of both :)

    In regard to the aesthetics of a map, every map has an aesthetic, it just matters how much a forger wants to put into it. I could pretty up the map with crazy looking walls and colors, but the frame rate would most likely suffer in some way. When I'm testing a new design I almost always build it with coliseum walls and brace larges first so the map can be tested with perfect frame rate. Let's hope Halo 4 offers more flexibility with what items can be used and still be safe with frame rate. That being said, I enjoy clean forging with interesting game play over aesthetics any day of the week.

    It's never to early to start a new design. Unconquered was first forged and tested in July 2011 and finally finished in February 2012. By it's first posting in October it had over 70 testers. The R&D time of a map can never be too long. I have no doubt that changes will be made to this map over time and I plan to share those changes with you. I'll react to news about Halo 4 and adjust accordingly. And when Halo 4 forge is revealed maybe I will push the design forward into something more 'ambitious.' But with every good map you have to start with a good design before you move forward.

    Simulacra is that design for me and a lot of players who have tested it. I really love this design and planned it with Halo 4's weapon drop system in mind. So to say it's a Halo 4 design is accurate. The beta is a way for me to start testing the map before Halo 4's release to work on the overall design in an extended R&D period. And who can say a longer testing/forging period of time is bad for a map? It's only going to make it better.

    Make sure you don't confuse me with Nak3d Eli. The trailer contains both of our game play and I had to play 20+ games to get my footage while he only played one. He's way out of my league. If you watch the full game of his I uploaded to my channel you'll see him tear us apart. Everything else in the trailer is from my POV. And yes I think I pulled off some pretty nice kills myself :)


    Now with all of the replies out of the way let me move on to some of the changes I've been working on.

    This is a game of MLG Slayer we played a few days ago. I'm sure you will very quickly see some differences in the aesthetics of the map. The reason for the change was to measure the map out to make the floor underneath the man cannon and out where blue team originally spawned at the same level. This also caused the original sniper room to drop by .3. I've also adjusted where blue and red teams spawn at the start and moved the sniper to blue teams old spawn location. The next step for the map will be to measure all of the sight lines and place some strategic blockers in place to force players to move more to get off shots room to room. The basic principle behind the sight lines and room to room interaction will remain the same however. I'm also ironing out some respawn issues.

    MLG Slayer on Simulacra
     
  18. Zombievillan

    Zombievillan Ancient
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    I wasn't critiquing your aesthetics, I'm taking your idea. In regards to building the map plainly, using only what you need then test it. I never did that
     

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