Caia

LOL I just kept reloading the page and this showed up.
It looks like a great map for a little 1v1 warm-up.
Seems a little cramped/close quarters from what i see... IDK yet Ill have to get a game on it this afternoon. Definitely has some familiar themes as Arca.
Love the use of banks and natural. And the door in the last pic looks great. Very unique.
The good thing about building small maps like this is the abundance of objects.
Could you incorporate a balcony of some-sort outside? Seems very inclosed.
Great map! Ill be sure to nominate it.

 

/Boredom Post yay

Man I am just not used to how hard you guys try to emphasize aesthetics. I am willing to bet that more time was taken to construct every portion this thread than to forge the map itself. My mind is blown about why you guys care so much about how the thread looks, and more notably the map. Aesthetics shouldn't overshadow design like nearly everyone thinks it does. It's just all your standards, I guess. But the thread looks incredible nonetheless.

Anyways, I'll get to the map. I played a 4p FFA on this a long time ago and I ran on the map today. I will cut back a little bit about the aesthetics. They are EXTREMELY well thought out. But it's just way too much. I realize it's not MLG, but MLG maps could like this too if they wanted to. It's just not our over-emphasis. Sniper side looks amazing because the aesthetics are most simple over there.

But the rest is all about using the plat XXL, brace larges, 1x2 ramps along the wall and even the floor, and 1x2's. I'm not saying they way you went is unoriginal, but completely unorganized IMO. My favorites on this side are the lights and the 1x2 ramp / Bank-ramp combo. I would personally like to see lights like that used more often; but as for the Ramp-bank combo, this would work better as an on-going theme in either more rooms (like a trail) or in a big atrium. Right now it there's to much to it, though it still looks cool.

Now, as for design, another bit I will give for these kinds of maps is that they are incredibly unique. But this suffers as bad as Catha does, if not worse (not to mention with aesthetics too). Like RoboArtist said, the map is overly close quartered, even though I don't agree to much else that he said. Again, the sniper room is fairly well-designed, but the rest is killing me. It is nothing but an over-complexity of routes, ramps, and lifts. There are too many ways to go and too little room to fight. In translation, 1v1 games will take long (trying to find either person) and most deaths will occur by melee attacks. It's just not halo. Also, your 1v1 gametype using 150% sounds like too much for how tight the map is.

Though if you don't like that "bashy" kind of feedback, I will add some other points. The complexity and close-quarteredness makes power weapons completely broken (The sniper seems like all about no-scoping beatdowns and the GL is just retarded without open space to aim/shoot; Camo/OS is irrelevant though). Also, I would strongly recommend changing up your teleporter system. The way you set it up is good in theory, but in reality, this is bad because one teleporter leads to the sniper and the other leads to camo. Since the senders are close enough to the power weapons, players could just go into one, get the sniper, go into the other, and get camo. They are abusable in that sense.

So yeah, this map and Catha have much in common (along with others). You just have way too much going on, especially for 1v1 and 2v2 gameplay. I left mammoth posts on Catha and this one because I played an FFA on each of them and enjoyed them very much; but only because FFA, in my opinion, is meant for more random and Chaotic gameplay. 1v1 and team maps should give you an emphasis on control on the map, but players can flank you from anywhere possible. As interesting as that unpredictability sounds, I personally believe this kind of gameplay should be more organized.

Don't take this as me being a *****, no matter how much it appears to be. The map is also not as bad as I depict it to be. This map still offers interesting encounters that promote good gameplay. I just think that this map would look and play better if it was simplified. Still go with the traditional 3 ways in/out routine, but just not so many places to connect that often. Plus, I am no bigshot when it comes to forging, but I just like to give feedback and I thought this would be pretty helpful.

Two maps down, too many to go.

 

^ quote with trimming,
It is my belief that forging a map IS an art form, and that there is more to map making than just running along monochrome floors or hopelessly clustered designs shooting each other, while it is VERY important that the layout and design are solid, in a good map, you should not only have fun, but be immersed, ones job as a map maker is to fool the player. When they see a room, they should not think "the room made of 5X5" but rather "the engine room" or such. longshot does a very good job of immersing the player and fusing pieces from individual forge blocks into the building as a whole.

With that I do have some reservations, the tight corners and hallways tend to lead to more CQC situations than I would Like and the long range weapons, small clip weapons ARE largely redundant due to the maps layout, and with a map this size I feel that teleporters would only make it that more complicated and that the teleporters should only be used as a means to improve the flow of the map, not to confuse the players.

well, that's my 1 1/2 cents

 

The work you put into that post was the rediculious thing about it lol. But when people put so much work into aesthetics and layout, they treat it as if a game developer created a new map from scratch, with pride.
Though its a shocker that the thread itself would be so decorated, its what pleases the audience...

 

Yeah I did take 20-30 minutes to make that post lol

I'm not trying to demean his layout and aesthetics. I only feel that he could simplify the design so he can make the best of the aesthetics. There are some amazing aesthetical pieces on this map, such as the "Walkway, large/3x1 flat" hallway or the trail of Bank-ramps and 1x2 ramps. After that, there are just aesthetics I see as randomly assembled and unorganized (As a whole!). Despite the need for orientation, providing an aesthetic "theme" around the map would show more aesthetic appeal (to me at least). Not meaning only one kind of aesthetic, but a small variety of aesthetics around the map that match together.

As for thread decorations, yeah, it does look incredibly appealing. But it is simply not worth the effort in regards to getting more players to download. Though others see the threadmaker as a person with strong dedication, but it doesn't prove anything about the map. It's just a coincidence that only the people with the mindblowing aesthetics make these kind of decorations.

 

Ok, i HIGHLY disagree with you. I do care a lot how a map plays, but if a map looks incredible, like this one, i wanna play it way more than a map that looks like gray crap. I think this one is amazing, because it looks like it is.

making a map play well and look well is a balance, like peanut butter and jelly. If you put too much peanut butter on your sandwich, it has a crappy bland taste that sticks to everything. If you put too much jelly on, it tastes pretty nasty too.

I think, and i think most people would agree with me, you have to balance a map so it not only plays well, but looks great. I think this map looks Awesome. I didnt play it but i am going to assume theres a good amount of peanut butter

 

Ironically, I think this map does look like a sea of mundane gray/matte colors... Reminds me of the scene in The Labyrinth where Jenifer Garner can't find her way out of a hallway because everything blends together and she can't see the gap in the wall staring her in the face. :/
That issue aside, everything felt cramped. The hall ways are all extremely narrow, the corners tight, and the pieces in general seem clumped together. Additionally, while the aesthetics may be nice, they seem to lack conformity or theme. Really, it seems like you plopped pieces together randomly to try to make something "pretty".

My suggestions for the map: Redesign it from the ground up. Widen the halls and play spaces and wall various segments in ways to differentiate them from one another.

 

Ok, and by your logic, I think that this map has TOO MUCH PEANUT BUTTER TOO MUCH JELLY. You do not want to eat too much peanut better and jelly because you do not want to get fat, like my friend IIITyrantIII.

I'm not trying to belittle the idea of aesthetics and complex designing. I just think he went too far with it. The sniper room has the right amount of peanut butter and jelly and tastes great (aside from the lift directing players to a receiver node), but the rest tastes rancid (though, again, with some exceptions).

 

Hey Jacky!

I'm really sorry i wasn't around for many tests on here, but when I played the map I really enjoyed it, as always. I'll have to play it a bit more to see if I like it as much as Anent, but I know it's a great map regardless. The sand sort of spices the map up a little, and as usual the textures and whatnot all look great. I'll come back and post more once I've gotten some more games on here.

The thread looks fantastic by the way.

 

i havent had a chance to play on this yet but from the looks of it, it looks brilliant with the sand and orange theme

 

hey map looks great, def will give a download. regardless of whats said it looks like a nice clean forge with consistancy and the rocky/sand areas are a nice break from the grey. will love to play a game on this when i get the chance

 

Lol, im glad you like my metaphor . I think it really does have too much jelly that doesnt compliment the peanut butter. Its kind of hard to see with the tinted pictures and all that, which i really dont understand. but anyway, i took a closer look today rather than last night when i was about to pass out from my fever/cold, and yes; the jelly is nasty. It looks really boxy with colorful lines. Like you left a cardboard box full of skittles in the rain lol

But, it does have high points. like the sniper room. and... the sniper room. so, yeah.

 

Compared to a map like Ether, I can't say that this map makes itself stand out nearly as much. However, it still has some interesting object usage, and I love how there is sand and how you can hear the ocean noises in the map. I'm gonna get another game on here and on Ether soon. I think this is your best map yet, Shotty, I'm sad i never get to play with you anymore though. I like the Psychoduck spawn system you have on here too, although I'm not sure about how well those actually work anymore. Longshot, get online sometime and play me on here.

 

There's no reason to compare this to Ether. They are different designs by different forgers.

I enjoyed watching this map develop over time, Longshot. I was happy to help test, and I always will be for any designs you have in store for the future.

The map played at a rather slow pace for a 1v1. Teleporters, hallway networks, and overlap provides a scavenger hunt style gameplay, which can get frustrating if you are impatient.

It has been said before, but sniper area is the best portion of the map. 3 different tiers, 4 entrances/exits, open LoS, clean forging: every characteristic a room should sport.

A fun map from a determined designer. Nice job.