I've heard the "AAs as pickups" argument from others - specifically Pegasi, who I love with an undying, manly, strictly platonic love. I'm not so sure. I guess it's maybe not that inequitable if everybody has sprint, but some armor abilities are serious game-changers on the right map. Can you imagine being the only guy on Uncaged with the jetpack, or the only guy on Sword Base with evade? Ewww. I do know though that I deeply disliked the Throwdown model (no AAs to start, but they were on the map as pickups) because those things are so useful; it was almost like having an overshield you could turn on and off at will. If I have to commit to a position here, ultimately I'd like Halo 4 to give us no armor abilities at all. Bring back equipment or do something new, and return movement speed to where it used to be by default. /thread re-re-jack
AAs on maps would function much like power weapons. I'd rather only play against on guy with evade than an entire team. Especially if they fought over it. If one guy gets a certain AA he deserves if because he had to work for it and didn't spawn with it. Also, with AAs being on the map you can easily specify which AAs you want on a certain map. Something which is impractical with gametype loadouts. Jetpack too overpowered on Uncaged? Switch it out with a different one.
Thread rejack denied! Personally, I think the Throwdowns approach of having only AAs as pick ups is a great idea. Only downside with some of the Throwdown maps was the inclusion of stupid ass AA's. Not all pick ups are good, and not all maps should have pick ups, but some maps greatly benefit from strategic pick ups such as JPs. Actually, its hard to think of any AA's being present on a map as a pick up other than JP's... Sprint I suppose could work, and maybe even Bubble.
I do like that part of it, but hey, if we're engaging in wishful thinking, they could just change the game so that you can specify map-appropriate loadouts in the map file. That way people can either run a game with your suggested loadouts, or do an override to replace them (sort of like selecting "map default" for weapons and vehicles, or choosing something else that replaces the defaults with other options). Personally though, I don't like them as pick-ups because they can be used as many times as you like. With most players it's not a huge deal, but some people know damn well how to use specific armor abilities to become almost unkillable. It is really, really annoying playing small games (like 2v2) when one guy has sprint or evade and you don't. You're constantly watching him flee around corners as you helplessly try to finish him off. It's theoretically more annoying playing a whole team of 4 with evade, but then at least you too can ALSO have evade. When one guy has it, it's the gift that keeps on giving... to just him. It wouldn't be as much of a problem if all AAs had a longer recharge time (which I think is a good idea in general), or if they had "ammo" and could only be used a few times before exhausting. Sprint is the one AA that I feel if anyone can have it, everyone should have it (or have the option to have it as a loadout). I agree that jetpack can work OK, but I still think the grav lift equipment in Halo 3 filled that role so much better - you had to pick where you wanted to use it, you couldn't just start flying around near-limitlessly.
The flare. I can't recall for sure but I think by default it was only on one map (Guardian) and quickly removed even from that for matchmaking, because everybody hated it. Personally I liked using it for its clearly intended purpose - jumping into the gold lift room and simultaneously blinding and pissing off everybody. That thing would have been a lot better if they made it directional instead of just area-effect. For that matter, they could have just put in a conventional flash-bang instead. Modern Warfare's FB was a lot better than the H3 flare.
Flare? Eeeewww. That thing was a bigger buzz kill than a dingo at a baby shower. I'm going to steer this thread back on track for a minute, and say that active camo should have stayed a pick-up. Or, if Bungie really wanted it to be an AA, it should have limited uses per spawn. I actually don't play many gametypes that use AA's, and only really play SWAT, which, I believe, is one of the best experiences you can have on Reach. You have to be on your toes constantly, everyone is on level ground as far as weapons/equipment goes, and there's no radar. Snipers is a semi-close second. But the unifying thing about them is Sprint is the main AA for both (apart from non-Pro Snipers), and is the best AA in the lineup. Realistically it shouldn't have been an AA, but meh. As for the Radar Jammer AA, I'd totally be on board with that. The tactical implications would be awesome, especially if you had good communication with your team. It would likely be exactly like camo, but without the camouflage, ie, radar jamming, no auditory feedback. Which would be a suitable counter, in my opinion. As for having the flare as an AA, I'm not going to even dignify that with proper response...
I think that Active Camo should only be used for sneaking up, and not hiding or camping. [br][/br]Edited by merge: This. Maybe people would be allowed to use Equipment for Loadouts? However, I think that that would then only be for Invasion, Custom Games and other specified Playlists. Imagine Invasion with Equipment... Oh my god that would be really epic.
I feel that basing a criticism of Evade on how it works out in 1v1 (which, I agree, is pretty horrible) isn't exactly fair. It's actually much better in 4v4 or even 2v2 simply because said guy is much easier to kill, and once you die you're right back to square one. Just look at MLG, Evade can be a big factor in games but only if someone good picks it up, just as with any power weapon. When a player like Pistola or Formal pick it up, especially alongside Sniper, GL or Rockets, awesome **** ensues. Yet you don't see it being used by worse players just to keep alive constantly. And tbh (of the ones that MLG allows at least), Evade is the most powerful AA. I know it's unlimited, but I just think that even then, you only have it for one life and had to work for it during that life, so it isn't overbearing. Perhaps it would be outside of MLG simply because there are other AAs which, even as pickups, could really hack me off. But even with JP on Uncaged, for example, one person having one for a single life would be fine by me. No one person has ever really frustrated me much with a single life just due to their use of JP. The exact reason I hate it on Uncaged is the spammed use of it, having to constantly look up to fight back when attacked, and generally ending up 2-3 shots down before you start firing as a result. One person, one JP, bring it. Again, more annoying in a 1v1, but 1v1 is a different beast and any hint of Evade or (depending on map) JP is probably best avoided there.
Radar is a crutch. Learn to play without it and you'd love a map wide radar jammer that you can drop.
Quote: Originally Posted by SecretSchnitzel I like Reach... In fact, I'd say NBNS(no-AA) DMR starts is one of the most enjoyable game settings I've played in Halo. About on par with H2 gameplay wise IMO. someone else on this thread: I'm actually quite happy with title update Reach, so long as armor lock is left out of the non-BTB games. The DMR rocks with bloom decreased (or as you suggest, removed). Reach is hardly a bad game. But still I say, off with camo's head! I copied/pasted these quotes to get both of them. I agree, when you remove Reach's biggest differences from H3, such as bloom and armor abilities, it's not bad. In other words, Reach is bad. I don't use Active camo, but it seems to me that it's much more versatile than a combo with a sniper. Let's face it, on many BTB maps you could get out of effective DMR range with a sniper such that AC isn't necessary for anything but killing the enemy sniper (hemorhage, boneyard, spire, renegade, trident, in fewer spots paradiso because the mountain blocks LOS). The DMR itself is a mini sniper, though, and even though AC has been reduced in duration by the TU, the precise ROF is the max ROF when crouched. In BTB, one can regularly fire at at enemy while scoped at a distance at which it is impossible to see well unscoped, and AC allows someone to watch an enemy walk away from cover to exploit that distance advantage. Even on smaller maps, if a player crouches in small rooms in which a radar sees further while they turn off their AC until they reach open areas where vision sees further (they could reactivate it then), they would frequently surprise enemies with the first shot or grenade, even if they would move slowly. I am glad that some one brought up how AC encourages camping. Some say that they use it to sneak past enemy teams in objective, but you can't move for your life when crouching. Also, has anyone noticed players on small maps that use AC while looking at you and wait, as if you were going to walk to the center of the dots for them to assassinate you? I spend time and waste nades trying to hit them, fortunate that they don't take their advantage. A grenade or the first shot is everything from a competitive perspective; AC is only balanced from a casual perspective. AC and AL convince me that Bungie was more interested in creating interesting gimmicks to appeal to players that couldn't get into any hint of the competitive aspect of Halo. I think that the only way to make a AC a balanced loadout (as a neutral AA or a classic powerup it would be fine) would be if if gave you ACTIVE camo, but you were shieldless for its duration, with the same radar jamming effects. Once you shoot, your AA depletes immediately, leaving you one shot. It could be used to sneak past enemy teams in objective. As for how the removal of radar encourages players to move to a two entrance room and stay there, I disagree. If you stay there, there is a 50% chance that an enemy who sees you sees your back. Constantly moving to decrease the chance that you will be approached from behind helps, but any branch in the path ahead of you puts at risk of looking the wrong way first (of course, if those pathways were long enough, radar wouldn't help anyway). I'm glad that no radar stays in MLG, though.