MW3 :: Out of the map on Outpost!

...again, completely missed the point. How good or bad you are has nothing to do with the level of cheating a glitch might be. You could have a kd of 100% and this would still be cheating to exploit the glitch. You need to stop this thinking of "I" and think in terms of everyone else.

...That isn't an argument for what you're saying. All that tells me is that is better fits the definition of cheating. "Exploiting something within a game that gives a player an unfair advantage over other players". If not everyone can do it then that fits that definition pretty well. And as most games have a terms of service agreement stating that if someone cheats they could be banned or face other consequences I don't see where you're coming from with this. Unless you have another definition of what cheating is that you tailor to your purpose. Yes, modding a console is a direct form of cheating but so is doing anything within a game that "gives players an unfair advantage over another player".

Again, not a point in your favor. It shows that Infinity Ward does not want people doing these sort of glitches. Like I said, pointing them out is fine, encouraged even. Telling others to use it online is not ok.

You also finish your statement with a profoundly douchebag thing to say. Other's misfortunes of having to deal with someone who is cheating should not bring you happiness, if that is true then you are truly a bully.

The largest problem is that people who tend to do these sort of things are also the largest hypocrites. They complain about the constant cheating in games and state that those games are less fun because of those who cheat. They then conclude that if they are to have fun in the game that they then need to cheat. When they are caught for cheating they then complain that a billion other people are doing it. Cycle continues on and on etc.

Please don't be one of those people, just play the game the way it was meant to be played. If you find a glitch that allows player's to exploit the game in a bad way, sure post a video about it, give a bug report (what everyone should be doing when they find a glitch) to the developer and play around with the glitch in private or where it can't do any harm. But don't go on live to exploit it or tell others to do the same as that is some extreme dickishness.

 

Camping with snipers is cheap, not exploiting.

You're just being childish now. Exploiting map glitches in multiplayer is against the rules.

 

A camping spot isn't an unfair advantage. That player can use all sorts of techniques to get a camper from lobbying grenades to using teamwork to gang up on the camper. If you can't determine the difference between cheating at a game and playing the game the way it was meant to be played then that is a problem.

I'm not going to respond to each lame justification you come up with for why you think its ok to cheat. Like I said, its fine if you want to share glitches to the public, don't encourage their use against other players online.

 

Again, you're applying your outlook (which is really self-centered) and applying it to everyone else.

By exploiting glitches for your personal gain you are removing the fun others are experiencing. Which is pretty much the definition of a bully. I can punch some kid to make myself feel better but from the person being beat-up's point of view they aren't having any fun at all. So your suggestion to people is to then become bullies themselves as that is the only way they can compete in the system you propose.

You are also changing the point of the message away from its original intent of "if its cheating, don't do it" to "well its just a game anyway" which is a classic form of deflection. You don't want to admit your wrong so you're aggrandizing the terms "serious emotional harm", "like life or death", "value your imaginary life too much", to make it seem like it is everyone else's problem if they take offense to what you're doing.

So, I'm sorry my "long replies" are bothering you but I didn't think I needed such long responses to tell you what should be obvious. If its cheating, don't do it. If you have to wonder if something is cheating, it probably is cheating, and don't do it. You seem to be missing the message I'm portraying while defending the one part that is indefensible. You can post your videos of glitches, talk about it, even explain the consequences of what using it would do, but do not encourage others to cheat. You make it sound like if you follow this simple guideline how much fun you have in games will greatly decrease. If you follow it then you will still have fun, you will get to still find glitches and share them with the public, and more importantly others will have fun and YOU WILL NEVER BE BANNED by the developers by just talking about it.

If you want to exploit glitches and do things in games you weren't meant to do there are entire modding communities who hold private sessions for all their shenanigans. Not that hard to join one of those communities and have as much fun as you want while not bothering people who play by the rules and play the game how its supposed to be played. Not much to ask for.

 

Are you seven? Next am I going to read, "bla bla bla can't hear you bla bla bla" as you hold your ears and stick out your tongue?

 

To be technical a reproducible glitch isn't an unfair advantage as everyone can do it without using 3rd party software (i.e. modding, hacking etc.). That's the problem with banning people for a glitch. There are no rules against exploiting glitches simply because they are mistakes made by the developers and it's not cheating.

Not to say that I approve of abusing glitches in any way but still.

Also, JFox, you're a dumbass.

 

There is a certain amount of honor rule that is a given with any game. The developers shouldn't be expected to tell you every single thing that could ever exist that you shouldn't do within a game. If it is a glitch that breaks the spirit of the game and would obviously be against the rules if the developer knew of it before hand then its something that shouldn't be done.

Let's use for example the one man army perk of mw1 as an example. People abused the hell out of it but it wasn't a glitch. The developers unfortunately left it overpowered but it wasn't a glitch, the developers knew full well how it would be used and intended people to use it the way it was used. How cheap or fair a game mechanic is depends on the populace that plays it and is subjective within that populace. If everyone decided all of a sudden that running around with your heads cut off and shooting at people with no use of cover or strategy (basically the opposite of camping that people somehow think is the only legit strategy) was now cheap and camping was all of a sudden not cheap that's how it goes because that is what the gaming community says is cheap, not the developers and what they programmed.

 

Why don't we just lock this thread and move on. There's not going to be any conclusion with this argument, it's just all differences in opinion.

 

There shouldn't be. It's not a debatable topic. It's a simple guideline to go by. If it breaks the games rules or seems like it would break the games rules then it shouldn't be done. I mean saying its a difference of opinion is like saying murdering someone is bad is a difference of opinion. Sure from the murderer's point of view I suppose they would disagree but the majority of society would agree murder is bad. Now, I'm not comparing the act of murder to cheating in terms of severity but just that its not a debatable issue as the majority of people would agree that cheating is wrong.

If discussing the morality of every single glitch that could ever happen is what this thread will turn into then yes, it should be locked. But the video is still informative and even though apparently that specific glitch is patched I don't want to give the wrong idea that videos detailing a glitch and how to do them is bad. It's the message of using them against others over live which is the "cheating" part.

 

I'm not debating whether abusing glitches is bad or not, but mainly that you shouldn't ban people for it. I think you need to be very clear about the distinction between abusing glitches and cheating. If we start banning people for abusing glitches where will it end? Like I said in the chatbox before, something like BXR buttonglitches and out-of-bounds glitches can both be abused and that's where the line between bannable and nonbannable glitches can get too blurry. I say keep it simple and don't ban people for (ab)using glitches.

 

Differences in opinion is a good enough cause for debate. However, people here are inflaming one another, which is not okay.

Also, forgehub has a reputation of being disdainful when it comes to order and "arguments." But of course, this is the internet, what can you expect.

Anyways, quit flaming.

BT approves of this statement.

 

How developers decide to punish offenses was never a topic within this thread and only in the chatbox. As I told you there, yes more developers should warn people for minor offenses, but if a developer bans someone over abuse of a glitch it isn't a defensible position anymore. It becomes a sign that the developers do not want you to do it so it shouldn't be done. The very fact that if something your doing is even the least bit questionable means not to do it online because why would you want to risk a ban? No matter how fair or unfair you think the ban would be if it came.

The BXR was never a glitch. Melee'ing someone removed their shield normally. X would cancel the animation which was done that way so players weren't stuck doing an animation they didn't mean to do, and switching to a battle rifle to shoot wasn't a glitch either. The fact that the process insta-killed people was cheap yes, but not a glitch as every part of the process of the BXR was programmed into the game to happen the way it happens when the buttons are pressed. Out-of-bounds glitches are basically what we're talking about here. Great to see and do in your private time but if you're doing them during live play that is an unfair advantage (no matter how many people know about it) and breaks the obvious rules of the game so it shouldn't be done.

As soon as you draw a specific line at what is bannable and what isn't it is basically telling people everything that wasn't specified as bad is ok to do. By keeping it generic and allowing the developer's ultimate discretion of what is wrong to do in their game it keeps the majority of people playing by the rules and the majority of people have fun because of that. The only people that would complain about this system are people that feel the need to toe the line and risk getting banned all the time.

You guys keep using that word...I don't think you know what it means. The only thing that has gone on in this thread is discussion. The only things that can be taken as flaming are when I inferred jfox was 7 (because his responses were getting progressively more childish) and if I'm infracted for that, whatever but that was the only thing that was remotely "flaming".

 

I'm kind of done with the discussion since we're not getting anywhere anyway, but may I ask you one last question? You do understand that all glitches are programmed in right? All glitches are a result of logical decisions of the game.

 

Inflammatory
1. Tending to arouse anger, hostility, passion, etc.

Look at the previous page for examples. Feel free to PM me if you want to talk more as this is getting off topic

 

You do understand what a glitch is right? It is a bug that occurs in the abscence or error of code. Glitches aren't programmed in. If a player clips through a map its because there was an error in the code or a lack of code to make sure that didn't happen.

Games are massive programs and bug testing is an extensive process but even very careful programmers who give a lot of time to bug finding, play testing, etc will miss a few glitches along the way. That doesn't mean the glitches were put in the game for your amusement. That is what an easter egg is. What might be confusing you is most sites will list many things that are actually not glitches as such because they don't know how to classify them. What do you call the BXR combo if not a glitch? A cheap maneuver? That doesn't roll of the tongue and that isn't as nice a description for people to use to refer to things like that.

I also don't get this attitude of "we're not getting anywhere". It's a simple view point. Cheating is bad. Trying to subvert the system by coming up with a justification for doing something you're not suppose to be doing is bad.

Erico, by that definition anyone can take offense to anything and claim it as an inflammatory statement. Your normal internet usage of flaming implies cursing, making racist/sexist/religious slights, etc. How riled up people get in a regular discussion is not what is associated with flaming until it gets to the aforementioned things.

 

If you'd like to know how to do it after patch, I can teach you. Good vid though.