Welcome, boys and girls. This is the first map I am publicly releasing. I started work on SpoonLocker more than six weeks ago and finished the main layout in a few days, but the tweaking-and-testing-and-tweaking phase has lasted up until yesterday. In the time that I started work on this map, I've already finished 95% of a symmetrical team slayer map, 75% of a large semi-symmetrical big team map, 15% of an asymmetrical slayer map, and toyed with quite a few throwaway ideas. I have spent a lot of time in forge. I've also spent a lot of time here, on ForgeHub, looking at community maps, seeing what works and what doesn't work. I am a long time Halo player and have done quite a number of map/level/environment designs before. I have a strong sense for multiplayer level design in Halo, so even though none of you know who I am or have played any of my maps before, know that, as a Halo fan, I am satisfied with my level designs, and feel very confident about what I have accomplished so far. You may be wondering what the deal is with the breakfast cereal theme. I have no good answer to that question. The original name for this map was Spoonybard because the initial design for the map was three interconnected spoon-shaped structures. I first heard the term "spoonybard" on another forum and figured that worked as a name, but I eventually wanted something even more unique that I actually came up with myself; hence: SpoonLocker. It rolls off the tongue nicer than Spoonybard too. I've tried really hard to make my level designs simple and easy to understand. SpoonLocker's layout is very open, so it's easy to see where everything is. One of my main approaches to level design in Forge is building with the terrain, not against it. I didn't try to build through trees or get frustrated when something didn't work exactly like I wanted it to. I kept my design ideas very flexible and used them more as a guide than a blueprint. If something didn't work, I tried something else or abandoned the idea. SpoonLocker is designed specifically for One Flag and One Bomb gametypes. It is possible to play Slayer, Team Slayer, King of the Hill and Oddball, but I highly recommend you only play One Flag/Bomb with at least 8 players. There ain't none. The only thing you might notice is some lag when you look at the grav lift, but there are zero framerate issues that have any affect on gameplay--I was extremely careful about that. 7 x DMR 5 x Needle Rifle 3 x Magnum 2 x Plasma Pistol 1 x Assault Rifle 1 x Plasma Repeater 2 x Needler 1 x Shotgun 1 x Gravity Hammer 2 x Sniper Rifle [1 spare clip, 60 sec respawn] 1 x Rocket Launcher [1 spare clip, 120 sec respawn] 1 x Grenade Launcher 10 x Frag Grenade 8 x Plasma Grenade 1 x Mounted Machine Gun 3 x Health Packs Spoon facts 101: The scooping section of a spoon is called the "bowl", the long section is called the handle, and the place where the two meet is called the "tang". One of my main level design philosophies is to make sure there are multiple ways of getting to every area on a map. The above picture shows the three ways of approaching the Bowl: the grav lift, the rock ramp, and the Handle. From the Bowl, there are five different ways to reach the flag; even a mongoose can reach the block where the flag spawns. Another level design philosophy I have is to make landmarks for players to quickly identify where they are on the map. This is extremely helpful for new players that are trying to learn the layout. The Ribs can be seen from the majority of the map, so it's very useful for identifying your location. I effing love the Mongoose, so I made sure most areas on the map had smooth, mongoose-accessible pathways. The ramp above is tricky, but allows drivers with a flag-wielding passenger to hit that big ass ramp and score immediately upon landing. The rock crest shown below is the intersection of most mongoose traffic; it has smooth rampways for mongoose traversal, so definitely take advantage of the fastest route between bases. Defense spawns much closer to their sniper rifle, the shotgun and the hammer, but offense spawns closer to the rocket launcher and will likely be the only ones going for the second sniper rifle up in the tower. The sniper rifles also have direct lines-of-site between their respective spawns. Thanks and have fun!
This looks very good. You've obviously been paying a lot of attention to crafting this. It's good to see so much commitment to gameplay mechanics and level design principles. Looking forward to playing a few rounds there.
No, no, no. Look at the first overview picture and back at your post. Look at the overview pic and then at your post again. I can bet you, you haven't even played it yet, so here's what I'm going to do. I'm going to rip you apart for being a ****ing noob. 1) Look at the placement of both bases in conjunction to the rest of the map. 2) Look at each structure placed in the map. The only level design mechanic this follows is that of Hemorrhage with an added aesthetic twist. Let's be honest here, just from the overview picture each structure has been haphazardly placed with no real design layout in mind. I can tell you exactly what went through your mind. You saw a post that was very well done with spruced up graphics and a detailed explanation of the map. How could you possibly know that the creator paid an immense amount of attention to game play mechanics and level design principles? Do you even know what those are? Throwing around generic terms without any real application to the map is both detrimental to the creator, because he isn't getting quality feedback and to other members who may see your post and think, hey this guy's right. You're not. /rant @the map Why are both bases so close together and the neutral high tower so far out of the way?
It's pretty hypocritical to tell someone they're wrong because they haven't played the map when you haven't even played the map yourself. The bases really aren't that close. No, the bases are not at opposite sides of the map, but the perspective I chose exaggerates the layout. This shot, from the opposite side, more accurately shows the layout. It's either have some extra terrain to run around in with a tower that oversees most of the map, or put a giant ugly wall in the middle of Alaska. The extra space does not detract from the map. Trust me, I would know.
Whoa, easy there Rusty. You're shouting for no reason. Did you actually read my post? I said the level looks good. I think it does - that's surely a matter of taste. It's also clear that Cluto is committed to level design principles, simply because he talks about them so much. He's aware of things like multiple entry/exits to bases, orientation through landmarks, and the rest. These things are obviously very important to game play. It's elementary level design. That's what I said. 'Course, that's just from a cursory glance at the post - I haven't had a chance to play the map yet. And neither have you, since the map is still at 0 downloads as of this writing. So instead of massaging your ego by ripping me apart for being a "noob", how about you give Cluto some actual feedback?
i gotta agree with rusty, looking at the tower at the top of that last pic you posted, its isolated from the rest of the map. it looks plain and dull.Everything above the round bunker is worthless space. Alot of open space with nothing around, away from where the action should be. Personally im not a fan of the building pieces, i think its unoriginal and it makes maps feel too similar to one another. It seems like you took more time making all the pics look flashy than you did on the actual map. P.S. SpoonyBard came from FFIV
he mad also I think the map looks pretty cool and I just have to say I like how SOME people apart of the forging community are actually using the landscapes that bungie provided for us, and they aren't just making more floating maps.
Thumbnail images must be an unedited picture of the map. Irregular formatting, or banners in your case, is not permitted. I'm going to remove the thumbnail, and you may choose what image of your map to replace it with.
My comment wasn't directed towards the map, but towards his comment about the game play when he hadn't played. The neutral tower though is still too far out of the way. No one has to play the map to recognize that. It just doesn't make any logical or game play sense to have the neutral location that far away from where the action is taking place without any sort of path directed over there. The quickest route to the other base is straightforward and the side routes don't offer much in the way of cover, so basically the map will play generally boring with few meaningful moments other than the random rofl rush. Open terrain maps rarely play well without any form of integral structure put into the map. There's always another way... My apologies for being an ass, but I want to make the point that you can't use generic phrases about game play mechanics without having played it. While I haven't played the map, I have played many open terrain maps that are similar to it. Open expanse, some random side structures, with sparse cover that 'compliments' the terrain.
First of all your map looks fun, ill have to DL it. Second, how do you get a Specified Picture for your map post on here?
I've had a chance to run around the map, and it looks interesting. From the layout it seems like flag capture runs will probably be quick and intense, mongoose-heavy. I hope the respawn times for the vehicles are nice and low! Since there are a lot of ways to approach the flag base, defenders will have their work cut out for them, which is good. (You can even ride a mongoose up the grav lift from the under-spoon bowl.) I see why you put the sniper tower so far away, Cluto. The sniper rifle there has enough range to reach the flag defence platform, but it's far enough away to make players there challenging targets. There's also a lot of cover for them. I wonder if sniping will be a lonely business - takes a while to get there (ca. 20 seconds), and there are only 2 clips. I wonder how it plays in a game.
You have thousands of posts here. With posts like this, I am surprised you are still allowed to post anything at all. [br][/br]Edited by merge: He has his opinion, I have mine, etc.. (**clipped offensive content here**) But I don't have a clue what set him off. So what if someone commented on it and gave you two thumbs up? Who cares? [br][/br]Edited by merge: So are you sorry or just trying to excuse yourself? If you really are sorry, you would just man up and say, "I was wrong for the words I used, please forgive me," and edit your post to remove the profanity. That's what a Christian, boyscout, or a real man would do, because it would be the right thing to do. Just saying...
For what it's worth, I think this map demonstrates a strong cohesive theme. I have no idea why a well-produced post with some attention paid to presentation should generate so much ill will. Nice work, Cludo.
Yip, you are very right and I am very wrong. I sincerely apologize for my comments. Can you all please forgive me?
I'm sorry for derailing the thread with a side discussion and the use of foul language. @Moxidas, I apologize for insulting you. Now, on to the map. I ran through it on forge and I honestly don't quite know where to start. My first impressions was that it was an open death trap for the attackers. Spawn points are highly vulnerable and it's easy to see multiple spawn hives from cover. The tower is too far out of the way. It takes longer to reach the tower than your opponent's base. The defender's can easily prevent someone from ever reaching the tower especially since defenders can quickly grab snipe off of spawn. On top of that the snipe tower is nearly completely useless since almost all critical game play takes place outside of the range of the sniper rifle's aim assist. The rib cage is completely useless and gimmicky and that whole path as a flank is highly susceptible to an overlook from the defender's base. There are only two paths to getting to the flag. Improvements: Add a that giant wall, it is possible to make it look good. Add another way into the base and take out of some of the clutter in there. If the defender's take control of the rocket spawn and that middle rock structure they can completely spawn trap the other team. So, the base needs to be expanded a little and raised to be on even footing with the rest of the map as well as more structure added to side routes for meaningful close to mid range encounters.
I like this rusty eagle better. You provided legitimate criticism this time--something that's actually useful to me. I'll get to work on these improvements after I finish up my small symmetrical map. MrGreenWithAGun's post is kind of confusing. I don't know what he's talking about or who he's apologizing to, but I guess we don't need to talk about it anymore. Moxidas, I really do appreciate all your support. Getting gangbanged by the ForgeHub community isn't the most happy feeling in the world, and I thank you for your positive attitude and levelheadedness.
Ha get SLAYED Moxidas. Jk No seriously though the tower is worthless but that has already been said. Now to the juicy stuff. JDB95's Review Gameplay: SpoonLocker does not have the best gameplay ever, nor the worst. It is nice how it play across Alaska the short way because it makes it possible to play with smaller numbers and larger numbers of people. The space, however is not very developed and seems as if it was forged somewhat "on the fly" Design: Looks unique but the sniper tower takes like 20 seconds to walk to which is a waste of time, and it is not even that advantageous to be up there because there is plenty of hiding spots for the people. The rest is alright but the ribs are not even that useful for anything except looks as navigating them is very choppy. The middle around the rocks is very open but the terrain separates the lines of sight. Forging Level: 1 Crap Poor Sloppy Acceptable Average Good Clean Very Good Amazing Perfection 10 z-fighting in attackers base!!!! Some objects seem rotated weirdly. Weapon Layout: There is not a lack of weapons, neither are there to many power weapons. Fairly balanced, good job. All in all...: well, the post is very very nice. really nicely presented. The map is alright but is a fairly unique concept and could improve with some work.
Wow, this map looks great. Each part of the map is easily identified and the multiple entrances really ensures that camping will be kept to a minimum. I'll give it a DL.
...Also to add to what I said earlier and I forgot to say, It doesn't actually look anything like a spoon and a bowl when you are in the game. This makes the name seem really weird for anyone who is playing the map without reading the post.
best this is honestly the best map in my opinion i have seen on the forums for reach. I download all the new maps that are worth looking at just about every day religously. I think this feels like a map that bungie would make. Its subtle how it blends with the terrain and feels like everything has just always been there. The one thing i would say though is that it desperatley screams for something like a warthog...so i added one and removed the mongooses. Wonderful forge...feel like it could legitimatley be in mathmaking...just my honest opinion